I'm in the process of sorting my two (new to me) vipers. I want to get all the free or inexpensive mods for reliability done before I start spending the big money. I have read in numerous posts about the needle settings, Im trying to make sure I get it right, I have a service manual available as my blue one came with one. The general consensus Ive gotten is 4th notch from the top with the shims on top of the clip. I am a hair confused as to how this will look upon completion, so if anyone has a pic, or can break it down a hair, Id appreciate it. I am not going to open the can of worms on the opticool gaskets, they will be installed later, and honestly, both my Vipers I think are "outstanding" examples of the machines, as my blue one has over 13,000 mi and my red one has over 7000 mi and are in great running condition. Thanks in advance...
I asked the same questions a few weeks ago and the general consensus was stock position (3rd notch with the 2 shims at the bottom). 2000 SRX 700.
super1c
Super Moderator
SXRider7Hundo said:
Im a lot like you. Both my vipers have had no problems at all. That includes mine when it was piped. I ran stock head gasket and stock needle position since ive owned my wifes and when i took mine to stock last season put the needles to stock also. I did have to change the head gasket on mine and went with the opticool just for safety. I will be changing all needles to 4th position both washers on top per mr viper recomendation on all 3 of my vipers for the upcomming season. This just helps get a bit more fuel in their during midrange running. I wont change my wifes headgasket over unless their is a reason. Here is a good post with pictures of changing needle position on the second page. Also i have a link to a good artical from mrviper about needle.
http://www.totallyamaha.net/forums/showthread.php?t=76702&page=2&pp=10&highlight=blowing+engines
Not sure if you read this post either but lots of good talk about needles.
http://www.totallyamaha.net/forums/showthread.php?t=79836&highlight=needles
Chris
Here is a good read from Hartman Inc. on needles:
JET NEEDLE:
Needle "E" clip position - This works in conjunction with the length of the straight section.
If the engine is too rich above 1/4 throttle, raising the needle "E" clip (effectively lowering it into the nozzle) will lean the mixture. Needle Taper - A larger taper will result in a leaner mixture in the first half of the taper and a richer mixture in the last half of the needle. Needle Jet: The needle jet (nozzle) controls the fuel/air mixture up to 3/4 throttle. How it overlaps with the jet needle depends on the jet orifice inner diameter, air bleed holes and type of nozzle.
Most modern Japanese carburetors use a fixed needle jet (nozzle) assembly, which cannot be removed, but with the TM 33 replacement is possible.
Caution: this is where MOST burn-downs occur. To see where you are on the "MID" (needles) run the engine half throttle on a long straightaway hit the kill button or turn key off while holding throttle in "MID" position (USE EXTREEM CAUTION NOT TO CRASH INTO ANYTHING OR ANYONE ELSE). Then pull the spark plugs. The parts of the plug you should be looking at are the positive electrode and first 1/4 of the ground electrode.
Best power will usually result in a cardboard colored insulator tip and light colored ring around the tip of the positive electrode. For the ground portion should be a light cardboard color running no more than halfway towards threads. The first three threads should be oily if you're running the correct heat range.
From Hartman Inc. regarding carb tuning:
JETTING: Always remember to change one carburetor component at a time and keep a record of your changes and effects.
IDLE to 1/4 THROTTLE: The AIR JET, PILOT JET and FUEL SCREW are most effective in this range When you want a leaner mixture use a LARGER AIR JET, SMALLER PILOT JET or turn the FUEL SCREW in. The opposite holds true for a richer mixture.
1/4 to 3/4 THROTTLE: The JET NEEDLE is the most effective component in this range. Raising the needle by lowering the "E" clip position at the top of the needle will richen the mixture. Lowering the needle will lean the mixture.
WIDE-OPEN THROTTLE: Changing the MAIN JET affects this range. Select the size, which offers the best wide-open throttle performance, then there is the option to install one size larger MAIN JET for ideal engine longevity.
JET NEEDLE:
Needle "E" clip position - This works in conjunction with the length of the straight section.
If the engine is too rich above 1/4 throttle, raising the needle "E" clip (effectively lowering it into the nozzle) will lean the mixture. Needle Taper - A larger taper will result in a leaner mixture in the first half of the taper and a richer mixture in the last half of the needle. Needle Jet: The needle jet (nozzle) controls the fuel/air mixture up to 3/4 throttle. How it overlaps with the jet needle depends on the jet orifice inner diameter, air bleed holes and type of nozzle.
Most modern Japanese carburetors use a fixed needle jet (nozzle) assembly, which cannot be removed, but with the TM 33 replacement is possible.
Caution: this is where MOST burn-downs occur. To see where you are on the "MID" (needles) run the engine half throttle on a long straightaway hit the kill button or turn key off while holding throttle in "MID" position (USE EXTREEM CAUTION NOT TO CRASH INTO ANYTHING OR ANYONE ELSE). Then pull the spark plugs. The parts of the plug you should be looking at are the positive electrode and first 1/4 of the ground electrode.
Best power will usually result in a cardboard colored insulator tip and light colored ring around the tip of the positive electrode. For the ground portion should be a light cardboard color running no more than halfway towards threads. The first three threads should be oily if you're running the correct heat range.
From Hartman Inc. regarding carb tuning:
JETTING: Always remember to change one carburetor component at a time and keep a record of your changes and effects.
IDLE to 1/4 THROTTLE: The AIR JET, PILOT JET and FUEL SCREW are most effective in this range When you want a leaner mixture use a LARGER AIR JET, SMALLER PILOT JET or turn the FUEL SCREW in. The opposite holds true for a richer mixture.
1/4 to 3/4 THROTTLE: The JET NEEDLE is the most effective component in this range. Raising the needle by lowering the "E" clip position at the top of the needle will richen the mixture. Lowering the needle will lean the mixture.
WIDE-OPEN THROTTLE: Changing the MAIN JET affects this range. Select the size, which offers the best wide-open throttle performance, then there is the option to install one size larger MAIN JET for ideal engine longevity.
SXRider7Hundo said:
Hundo, the viper has leaner carb settings then a srx does, they use leaner nozzles,needles and slides, BUT.. they have way more ign. timing and a higher compression ratio, so this is a recipe for detonation with this crap they call gas these days. By richening up the needle you will make it slightly richer and most of the time this is where the viper will do a lean burn on the piston. Put the needle clip in the 4th groove down from the top but place both plastic shims on top of the clip instead of 1 on each side or under the clip. If you put them under the clip it will likely be blubbery sounding and not run very well in the cruise spot. By doing this your richening them up a half spot and help the mid range fuel mixture to be richer and have less heat resulting in less chance for detonation to start.
Mr. Viper. Great info. Sorry to hijack thread but what do you recommend for stock 200 SRX?
Great. Thanks for the links. Super1C, Ive been wantin to ask you, do the ohlins make a big difference in the back? More less the front too? All around? Im thinking of spendin the dough to get this set up for mine.
super1c
Super Moderator
SXRider7Hundo said:
The ohlins in the skid are by far the single best mod iv'e done to my viper. First year i had it i ran with stock shocks. My ride in the U.P. that year in the ruts on trail 8 heading down to trail 7 to get to the buck horn at 10PM was the worst ride of my life (those that have rode that know how bad it gets). Had to ride the side at a snail pace to make it. This past year with the ohlins was awesome to say the least. I was ridding all out down the middle without a problem. I could not believe the difference they made. It soaked up the ruts no problem. I would recommend for sure. I have the 03 rx1 ohlins with the resevoir. I had them rebuilt and revalved by carver for my weight and style before install. I also rebuilt my whole skid per BETHEVIPER's post. I can not say enough on how much i like them. If you havent read BTV's skid post here's the link, great read and i also recommend you do this even if you dont get new shocks. A rebuild and revalve will make a huge difference with your stock shocks for sure. Pioneer perf will rebuild and revalve all 4 for $179. Well worth it if you dont go with ohlins. Pioneer and carver are also site sponsors. Here's the link!! http://www.totallyamaha.net/forums/showthread.php?t=30541
http://www.totallyamaha.net/forums/showthread.php?t=34503
http://www.totallyamaha.com/snowmobiles/aaTECH/Ski_Alignment/Ski_Alignment2.htm
Chris
I just changed my needle settings last week to fourth from top with the two plastic washers on top, stock was in third notch with both washers below the clip.
No big job----dental tools came in handy.
And I sure it was stated before but the hex wrench (2.5 mm) must be ball end.
No big job----dental tools came in handy.
And I sure it was stated before but the hex wrench (2.5 mm) must be ball end.
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Isnt that the same setting?clip in 3rd groove with both washers under is clip pos. 3,clip in 4th groove with both washers under is clip pos.4, with 1 under and 1 over it is clip pos. 3.5, so with both washers on top it is clip pos, 3!!!
sxr1000 said:
Nope, it's a touch richer at 4 and both over than at 3 with both under