New Track Trouble

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YamaSmith700

New member
Joined
Feb 15, 2020
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15
Location
Maine
I have an 02 Viper that I extended to 144 using tracks usa kit and viper mountain tunnel. I have a camso cobra track 1.352" lug(No Picks) installed that keeps loosening up. After the first couple adjustments i chalked it up to normal track stretching. I have 500 miles or so on the track and extension upgrade and have adjusted the track four maybe five times now. All the track drive and chaincase/jackshaft bearings are brand new. Each adjustment I've tensioned the track to about 1-1.5" sag at center with no weight and aligned.

Couple other issues I've had with the new track setup: At slow speed I can feel what seems like the track rubbing on the tunnel somewhere judging by the vibration and noise it makes. This goes away upon accelerating & at speed.Note*(The exchanger and tunnel protectors have been removed for clearance) Also I burned through a new set of hyfax in under 400 miles, worn through to the rail in one small spot both sides just in front of forward most idle wheel.
 

I have 6500 hard miles on my 136 x 1.35 Corbra, and holding up well.

Track stretching alot for the first 1000+ miles is normal, readjusted mine many times like you. Are you currently out of adjustment?

On the low speed vibrations, I've also noticed it to. You d swear the track is rubbing on something but it's not. Guess I just blocked it out of my thoughts after all this mileage

Melting sliders is very odd, I easily get 3000 miles out of a set with this track. Just installed my 3rd set last fall, and I buy the cheap 50$ ones from Royal D
 
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The vibration/rubbing noise I hear appears to be coming from the back of the skid. The hyfax is a little longer than the rails and i can hear it rumble on the clips when i lift the sled and spin the track. Did a 150mi ride today, sled ran great except for one hiccup 10mi into the ride after a high speed run down a straight away. Upon decelerating it was as if the clutch shifted in low gear so to speak and there was engine breaking slowing me down so fast on coasting that the track nearly locked up. Once I came to a complete stop the sled would not move nearly burned a belt trying to get it to move. After yanking on the secondary clutching while another person lifted the rear i broke the track free and away I went trouble free for the remainder of the ride.
 
That last sentence about the secondary ..... I'm thinking of a bearing. Possibly w/ an AFU race and B.B.s. Mabey it was the yanking and rocking on the secondary that put them back in place. Speedo side??
Have you opened up the chaincase since the track installation?
Obviously I'm just chucking ideas out here.
 
Hyfax are worn out again in the same spot. That's the second set of hyfax in less than 700mi. This can't be right. Maybe it's just the geometry of this particular skid but all my other sleds will go easily thousand miles plus on a set of hyfax in the same conditions.
 
Yes both sides are wearing evenly. The hot spot is at the front end of skid just in front of the most forward idle wheel where the rail begins to curve up. Maybe bigger idler wheels would take some weight off that part of the hyfax? I'm running the track about as loose as I dare to. By the end of the ride the track was ratcheting under full throttle take off, may have been caused by the extra slack from hyfax wear. There seems to be a fine line between too tight and so loose the track track ratchets with this sled.
 
Interestingly my sled is a 136" from factory and as already mentioned my sliders last reduculiously long. ( 3000 miles). But my brother's proaction is stretched to 136" and he burns threw sliders MUCH faster. At 500 miles his sliders are already almost toast. Witch is bizzard cause 95% of the time we are riding together!!! We still haven't figured what the Hell is going on there.

And you will need to run your track tight. Forget about the 1" deflection at X amount of weight. It doesn't work. Mine always still racheted following Yamaha specs. These tracks must be run tight. No way around it
 
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Vincent said:
Interestingly my sled is a 136" from factory and as already mentioned my sliders last reduculiously long. ( 3000 miles). But my brother's proaction is stretched to 136" and he burns threw sliders MUCH faster. At 500 miles his sliders are already almost toast. Witch is bizzard cause 95% of the time we are riding together!!! We still haven't figured what the Hell is going on there.

And you will need to run your track tight. Forget about the 1" deflection at X amount of weight. It doesn't work. Mine always still racheted following Yamaha specs. These tracks must be run tight. No way around it
Click to expand...

I can't really say that the rail extension is what caused the rapid hyfax wear. I didn't ride it long enough in stock form to compare. If I look at the original hyfax from the previous owner there is a more even spread of wear vs mine where it is more focused in one spot. Also at the same time I extended the rails I added a good amount of preload to the front shock, backed off on the limiter straps and set the full rate adjuster on rear shock to softest setting. I cant believe that would have been a cause either as that should increase weight transfer toward the rear under power and the rear half of the hyfax show little to no wear.
 
I run a Mnt. Viper, stock track, tunnel, suspension, and got about 3k to my first set of hyfaxes (still on 2nd set). I did have the most wear on them in the exact place you're getting yours, right after the bend in the rails. I'm far from a suspension set up guy so I can't offer much there, but I do have very little preload (so the track doesn't trench in deep snow) and the limiter straps are as loose as I can get them without fear of the jam nut coming off. As a powder rider I want maximum transfer and thus my skis aren't on the ground much when the fun button is being squeezed...much different setup than you'll want as a trail rider I realize. But here's my thoughts on your troubles:

First off, I find that adjusting the track is best done while out riding. New tracks do stretch for a bit, throw out the factory setting of x sag measurement and just adjust it while out riding. Go up a 1/2 turn on each side at a time until the ratcheting stops. That will get you the loosest setting you can have without ratcheting. Carrying a 17 & 19 end wrench and socket with short extension doesn't take up much room in the trunk.

A 144 is quite a bit of track riding on the hyfaxes for straight trail riding. I don't think you're getting enough lubrication in there. I didn't see where you said anything about running some kind of ice scratcher set up? Your long straight away run that resulted in the track being glued to the hyfaxs' is a pretty good sign. I did that just a couple of years ago, early morning riding on the trail to get to some play areas and the snow was pretty hard from it being above freezing the day before and then below that night. I stopped on the edge of the trail and kicked snow into the skid several times, but didn't do it often enough apparently. I could smell them once we stopped and had to have a friend lift up the sled while I kicked down on the edges of the track to get it unstuck from the hyfaxs after we had sat there for a bit and then went to take off again. I really think you're not getting enough snow in there to lube the hyfaxs.

Snow conditions really play into it, hard snow is terrible for getting into the skid area.
I see Vincent is running a 136 and getting good wear...hey Vincent are you running any kind of ice scratcher setup or always have fairly soft snow to run on?
 
The rail extensions are tip ups so really all that extra track isn't making full contact on the hard packed trails. Once I go off trail and into some powder thats when the extra track really comes into play. I've been thinking I should install some scratchers but they would have to be mounted in front of the track to be effective where my hyfax are wearing. Just went out again today on a pond covered in 4-6" of soft stuff. Did another track tension and alignment before heading out. After 30mi track starts to ratchet again. It only happens if I goose it from a stand still, easing into the throttle no issues.

Also, would changing from a 121-144" track affect the gearing at all. The sled will pull just over 9K wide open. Somewhere around 3/4 throttle it settles into 8500 which feels right that last quarter of throttle doesn't give me much on the top end just sort of winds the engine out more. Everything is stock except the track rails and tunnel.
 
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Having ice scratchers will help a lot, even if it isn't throwing the snow straight onto the spot that wears the most. The snow will get carried all throughout by the track.

It seems excessive to have to adjust the track so much, I remember having to adjust mine only a couple of times when it was new and then it stayed put for a long time. I had to tighten it a couple of years ago and now this year after my first ride (yesterday as a matter of fact) I had some ratcheting and need to go another 3/4 of a turn on each side or so. I'm not ratcheting on the trail, just when I load the track hard in deep snow. I wonder if yours is somehow loosening up on you? I'd look everything over very closely.

Going from a 121 to a 144 will certainly effect clutching and gearing...did it not get geared down a bit when the track was changed? I'm surprised you're seeing to high of peak rpm's if the gearing wasn't lowered a bit when it was extended. I think a factory short track viper had 22-38 gearing, is that what you still have? My uncle went to an 1-1/2" track on his 02 viper...stayed a 121...and geared it down a bit.
Perhaps Vincent will chime in with what gearing he's running with his 136.
 
mod-it said:
Having ice scratchers will help a lot, even if it isn't throwing the snow straight onto the spot that wears the most. The snow will get carried all throughout by the track.

It seems excessive to have to adjust the track so much, I remember having to adjust mine only a couple of times when it was new and then it stayed put for a long time. I had to tighten it a couple of years ago and now this year after my first ride (yesterday as a matter of fact) I had some ratcheting and need to go another 3/4 of a turn on each side or so. I'm not ratcheting on the trail, just when I load the track hard in deep snow. I wonder if yours is somehow loosening up on you? I'd look everything over very closely.

Going from a 121 to a 144 will certainly effect clutching and gearing...did it not get geared down a bit when the track was changed? I'm surprised you're seeing to high of peak rpm's if the gearing wasn't lowered a bit when it was extended. I think a factory short track viper had 22-38 gearing, is that what you still have? My uncle went to an 1-1/2" track on his 02 viper...stayed a 121...and geared it down a bit.
Perhaps Vincent will chime in with what gearing he's running with his 136.
Click to expand...

Don't run scratchers. My gearing is stock 22/39....
 
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mod-it said:
Having ice scratchers will help a lot, even if it isn't throwing the snow straight onto the spot that wears the most. The snow will get carried all throughout by the track.

It seems excessive to have to adjust the track so much, I remember having to adjust mine only a couple of times when it was new and then it stayed put for a long time. I had to tighten it a couple of years ago and now this year after my first ride (yesterday as a matter of fact) I had some ratcheting and need to go another 3/4 of a turn on each side or so. I'm not ratcheting on the trail, just when I load the track hard in deep snow. I wonder if yours is somehow loosening up on you? I'd look everything over very closely.

Going from a 121 to a 144 will certainly effect clutching and gearing...did it not get geared down a bit when the track was changed? I'm surprised you're seeing to high of peak rpm's if the gearing wasn't lowered a bit when it was extended. I think a factory short track viper had 22-38 gearing, is that what you still have? My uncle went to an 1-1/2" track on his 02 viper...stayed a 121...and geared it down a bit.
Perhaps Vincent will chime in with what gearing he's running with his 136.
Click to expand...

I just pulled the skid out of the track to really go over it with a fine tooth comb. Everytime I adjusted the track I make sure to torque axle 54ftlb. The nut is always tight when I go to readjust the tension. Even tried torquin the adjusters after torquing the axle in case it loosened up on me didn't make any difference. measuring from the little mark on the hyfax I have 3/16" left on the low end and full or 3/8 on the thick end this is the amount of wear in just 300 miles.

I thought I was going to have to gear down for the extension pulling a longer, heavier track with more lug. Glad I didn't this sled rev's out like crazy. Wack the throttle and its pulling 9k rpm until I let go, I think i even saw 9200 rpm on one longer pull today. It actually concerns me a little bit top speed is 102 indicated which is plenty don't get me wrong but I can only imagine what it'd do If I could keep the rpms in the peak of the powerband. Trail riding just cruising around 45-55mph its hard to keep the rpms below 7k. The gears are stock 22-38, belt is oem yamaha tensioned within spec. The helix on the secondary is in the 6 hole. Both primary and secondary springs are stock I believe(black with white dot) not sure about weight rivets etc.
 
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