KbxSrx
New member
- Joined
- May 20, 2003
- Messages
- 192
- Age
- 57
We mountain riders finally got what we have been asking for! For a few years now, we have been looking for Longer track, more hp, lighter weight, better handling, and now, its available!!! Skidoo, Cat and Polaris have handed us some wonderful mountain sleds. Which brings us to the problem. Obviously, the big 3 watch the boards, read the comments, take to heart what the consumers outwest have been asking for and deliver. So, do we shut up and quit giving the big guys ideas, or do we keep trying and hold onto faith for old blue? 
hehe I couldnt resist, it was Junior's idea, really!
hehe I couldnt resist, it was Junior's idea, really!
Bakemono
New member
The question of the ages
Personally, for me, there is no other brand of sled than Yamaha.
Sure, you can look at the other brands and see a better suspension or a more powerful engine. However, when you put together the total package, no one really has a better overall sled than Yamaha.
Lets take the Polaris EDGE. Good sled, my parents ride them and they ride very, very nice. However, if you ride in in conditions where the snow is hardpacked or if you do any roadriding to get to the snow, they have a tendency to overheat. Also, Polaris has questionable build quality.
Ok, now look at the REV. If you want a hardcore ditchbanger or if you are a snocross wannabe, the REV is great. However, all the ones Ive seen are very tippy and if you are just a casual rider (meaning someone who just wants to get out and ride, but not race from bar to bar) the REV isnt so great. I rode one last winter at the Eagle River derby and you almost have to stand up to ride it. To me, it could be compared to the old stand-up watercraft (like the Yamaha SuperJet) in that you had better be in shape, or else you will be hurtin' at the end of the day.
This leads us to Arctic Cat. Make no mistake, the Cats are fast, but they suspension sucks unless you like to jump. Basically Cat sets their sleds up to race snocross, with stiff springs and lots of preload. Granted, you could put in softer springs and buy some Ryde FX shocks to get less dampning. However, after you spend $7000 on a sled, should you really have to spend another $500-$1000 to make it ride nice? Also, look at Cat's a-arms, they are so dinky and look like if you hit a rock they would break right off, the ones on the REV are a little better but not much. Cat also has had a lot of problems with their engines mostly related to oil pump failures. Arctic Cat's clutches are really bad too. A friend of mine who races snocross runs a ZR 440 and he doesnt even run the Cat clutch. He always used a Polaris primary clutch because it holds together a lot better.
Yamaha isnt perfect, but they are the closest thing to it Im yet to see.
Yamaha has the best build quality and fit and finish of any of the manufacturers and while they may not have the freshest designs and may not follow the current market fads, with a Yamaha you know you are going to get a sled that you can ride without having to worry about fixing it all the time.
2 years ago, when the RX-1 first came out, there was a little side note in one of the snowmobile magazines about warranty claims for that year. It had said that even thought the RX-1 was a new sled for that year, it had the fewest warranty claims or ANY sled that year.
However, I dont feel that we should shut up about what the OEMs should be building. To those of you who think that its just Yamaha who doesnt listen to the consumer, you are very much mistaken.
For years I wrote Polaris and told them how I was unhappy with their lineup or told them things that I thought would be good to bring out.
Back in 1995 before the whole "color option" thing was available, I wrote Polaris and told them it would be cool if you could pre-order sleds in the color you wanted. I said maybe you could have a sled in a choice of 3 or 4 colors to sort of customize it, much like you can do with a motorcycle.
They wrote me back and said that just wasnt possible, and that people wouldnt go for a color option program. You can imagine how I felt when the next spring when they had their "snow check" program and low and behold if you preordered your sled you could get it in a choice of 3 different colors.
The big thing when you are anticipating where a market is headed is not so much to give the customer what they want TODAY, but to anticipate what they will want TOMORROW. By the time you get product out that is set to their needs for today, its outdated anyways. Sometimes you guess right, sometimes you guess wrong.
You could say that Yamaha was ahead of the game back in the mid 90s when they had the big twins. However, back then the market was all caught up in the fad of the lightweight triples and twins just were cool.
Now everyone has their big bore twins (just as Yamaha did in the mid 90s) and they are putting down Yamaha because they are running the lightweight triples. Ponder this for a second, maybe Yamaha is one step ahead and the market is going to head back to lightweight triples.
Ive owned them both and I personally prefer a smooth-running triple.
I think its going to be very funny watching the othe OEMs try to make their high-output 4-strokes. Right now Cat has their 660-T that they think is so great because it makes around 80 hp. I would laugh if Yamaha came out with an RX-1 Turbo that made 180 hp. Heck, the naturally-aspirated one currently makes 140, they could easily get 40 more hp with a very mild turbo.
Personally, for me, there is no other brand of sled than Yamaha.
Sure, you can look at the other brands and see a better suspension or a more powerful engine. However, when you put together the total package, no one really has a better overall sled than Yamaha.
Lets take the Polaris EDGE. Good sled, my parents ride them and they ride very, very nice. However, if you ride in in conditions where the snow is hardpacked or if you do any roadriding to get to the snow, they have a tendency to overheat. Also, Polaris has questionable build quality.
Ok, now look at the REV. If you want a hardcore ditchbanger or if you are a snocross wannabe, the REV is great. However, all the ones Ive seen are very tippy and if you are just a casual rider (meaning someone who just wants to get out and ride, but not race from bar to bar) the REV isnt so great. I rode one last winter at the Eagle River derby and you almost have to stand up to ride it. To me, it could be compared to the old stand-up watercraft (like the Yamaha SuperJet) in that you had better be in shape, or else you will be hurtin' at the end of the day.
This leads us to Arctic Cat. Make no mistake, the Cats are fast, but they suspension sucks unless you like to jump. Basically Cat sets their sleds up to race snocross, with stiff springs and lots of preload. Granted, you could put in softer springs and buy some Ryde FX shocks to get less dampning. However, after you spend $7000 on a sled, should you really have to spend another $500-$1000 to make it ride nice? Also, look at Cat's a-arms, they are so dinky and look like if you hit a rock they would break right off, the ones on the REV are a little better but not much. Cat also has had a lot of problems with their engines mostly related to oil pump failures. Arctic Cat's clutches are really bad too. A friend of mine who races snocross runs a ZR 440 and he doesnt even run the Cat clutch. He always used a Polaris primary clutch because it holds together a lot better.
Yamaha isnt perfect, but they are the closest thing to it Im yet to see.
Yamaha has the best build quality and fit and finish of any of the manufacturers and while they may not have the freshest designs and may not follow the current market fads, with a Yamaha you know you are going to get a sled that you can ride without having to worry about fixing it all the time.
2 years ago, when the RX-1 first came out, there was a little side note in one of the snowmobile magazines about warranty claims for that year. It had said that even thought the RX-1 was a new sled for that year, it had the fewest warranty claims or ANY sled that year.
However, I dont feel that we should shut up about what the OEMs should be building. To those of you who think that its just Yamaha who doesnt listen to the consumer, you are very much mistaken.
For years I wrote Polaris and told them how I was unhappy with their lineup or told them things that I thought would be good to bring out.
Back in 1995 before the whole "color option" thing was available, I wrote Polaris and told them it would be cool if you could pre-order sleds in the color you wanted. I said maybe you could have a sled in a choice of 3 or 4 colors to sort of customize it, much like you can do with a motorcycle.
They wrote me back and said that just wasnt possible, and that people wouldnt go for a color option program. You can imagine how I felt when the next spring when they had their "snow check" program and low and behold if you preordered your sled you could get it in a choice of 3 different colors.
The big thing when you are anticipating where a market is headed is not so much to give the customer what they want TODAY, but to anticipate what they will want TOMORROW. By the time you get product out that is set to their needs for today, its outdated anyways. Sometimes you guess right, sometimes you guess wrong.
You could say that Yamaha was ahead of the game back in the mid 90s when they had the big twins. However, back then the market was all caught up in the fad of the lightweight triples and twins just were cool.
Now everyone has their big bore twins (just as Yamaha did in the mid 90s) and they are putting down Yamaha because they are running the lightweight triples. Ponder this for a second, maybe Yamaha is one step ahead and the market is going to head back to lightweight triples.
Ive owned them both and I personally prefer a smooth-running triple.
I think its going to be very funny watching the othe OEMs try to make their high-output 4-strokes. Right now Cat has their 660-T that they think is so great because it makes around 80 hp. I would laugh if Yamaha came out with an RX-1 Turbo that made 180 hp. Heck, the naturally-aspirated one currently makes 140, they could easily get 40 more hp with a very mild turbo.
Yamaha needs to offer more in there lineup, For example: My type of riding is all trail; bumpy, jumpy, twisty and ditches. No mountains, no powder and very limited cross country. I probably speak for 99% of the riders in the north east. When the viper came out in 02 I bought it, riding zr suspensions all my life this viper sounded like the real deal for my riding. It was, it handle much better than a zr in the fast bumps, felt lighter and more nimmble in the air but it killed your back after a day. Jumping? forget it, I have already bent the running boards, 1 trailing arm and have replaced 2 black dashes that cant seem to stay together were they bolt on. I like the viper, dont get me wrong yamaha builds a good machine. You call us sno-x wannabes, thats just the type of riding we have and yamaha just doesnt offer the hard trail rider a sled, period. True my friend had alot of recalls on his 03 FC but AC fixed all of them and even threw in $100 and a gallon of oil for his troubles. Not only does AC offer the mountain riders, cross country and powder riders a sled they offer the ditch bangers one as well and even go as far as 2 options for the FC suspensions! Now I have never rode the snopro FC but I have the standard FC and it is a dream in the bumps, No yamaha suspension even comes close to this. I only hope that next year yamaha steps up to the plate and offers us "wannabes" a real ditchbangin sled, I know they can do it better! But beware yamaha, "You blew smoke up our rusty bullet holes once" we our wiser now!
vmaxjohn
New member
Well...Yamaha will put into production what they can sell. Evidently mountain riders don't spend enough on new sleds every year to warrant a TOPEMALL sled from Yamaha. Can they do it? Sure.
I hope Yamaha goes with wider tracks, not longer tracks. It just makes sense to make some small mods, instead of big ones. If the RX1mountain had the best floatation available, I'm guessing the power would do fine. Wide wide wide world of skis needs to happen though.
By the way, I know that folks from Yamaha get on here, and are listening and reading what goes on here, even some of the ways we go about tuning and fixing little problems. Of course they're focus is trail sleds though.
Keep bitching, but back it up with good, feasible ideas.
I hope Yamaha goes with wider tracks, not longer tracks. It just makes sense to make some small mods, instead of big ones. If the RX1mountain had the best floatation available, I'm guessing the power would do fine. Wide wide wide world of skis needs to happen though.
By the way, I know that folks from Yamaha get on here, and are listening and reading what goes on here, even some of the ways we go about tuning and fixing little problems. Of course they're focus is trail sleds though.
Keep bitching, but back it up with good, feasible ideas.
Junior
New member
I had nothing to do with this
- that is all
Right on john! They will build what they can sell. I do love my yamaha, but 05 is my buy new year and pol,cat,doo all have some tasty options in sleds. I started riding the tug hill area 5 years ago, an awesome place to ride and very very popular with riders. Back then you seen a good mix of brands&models, but i tell ya since the rev and fc the scales have definetly tipped hard. You see more cat and doo than anything and i bet this year and next polaris will be very popular also with there new sleds.