Viper all over the trail...

ajviper

ajviper

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Mar 10, 2004
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I'm not sure if this is due to the suspension setup or a track issue.

I was finally able to put some miles on the viper over the weekend since purchasing it this last fall and I have a question regarding the way it handled in loose snow pack. At speeds greater than 60mph, i had a hard time feeling in control due to the rear of the sled sliding all over the place. I don't think it's a darting issue, but more of a track issue because it felt as if the track was not hooking up. Again, it would only happen at speeds greater than 60mph and on loose snow pack. It was fine on the hard pack at the same speeds.

Did the '02 viper tracks have performance issues?


TIA
 
Huh?

I would turn down your center shock spring preload. turn up the rear shock slightly. fishtailing correct? It's probablly set up for a heavy rider correct? make sure the rear shock limiter is not too tight. Basically you have too much front skid pressure, you want more pressure on the rear boggies.
 
vipertripplexxx said:
I would turn down your center shock spring preload. turn up the rear shock slightly. fishtailing correct? It's probablly set up for a heavy rider correct? make sure the rear shock limiter is not too tight. Basically you have too much front skid pressure, you want more pressure on the rear boggies.
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you dont even have a clue
 
ya your right

ajviper,
Try what I said and get back too us on it. I'm positive this will help you out.

bluewho,
Stick it where the sun don't shine. You should not post if you don't know what the he11 your talking about!

Anybody else want to reply on what happens when you turn up the rear center shock preload too high? Sled will fishtail like crazy with too light of a rider! especially when you let off the gas.
Iv'e fixed this problem on many of friends sleds when there lighter significant other got on the sled and complained about fishtailing, just turn down the center shock preload and see what happens. Proof is in the actual results not what some moron tells you!
 
bluewho said:
you dont even have a clue
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thats a bit rude! also he needs to get some weight farther back on the track. if the weight is near the front of the track it acts like it has a short wheelbase making it unstabil at high speeds. shimming the skis should help too. sometimes its hard to tell where its coming from when you have a death grip on the bars trying to keep it strait!
 
Viper Darting

Put on a set of Woodys Doolies, suck up the limiter strap till you have about an inch of thread and it's fixed. Worked on my 2003, also make sure when you sit on the sled the gap at the transfer rods is equal top and bottom. This goes back to what someone said about the spring being too stiff.

Did the same thing on my APEX GT
 
Doolys will help a sled from darting as well as scrub off speed, however if the back end is wandering its because there is too much weight on the front and none on the rear, its looking for traction, loosen the limiters, tighten the center a little, soften the rear a little, toe the skis out about a 1/4", go try it again
 
Thanks guys... It is hard to tell what was happening while riding at higher speeds, but yes it would fishtail all over the place.

So I need to crank up the center spring and let out the rear spring?
 
So I need to crank up the center spring and let out the rear spring?
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however if the back end is wandering its because there is too much weight on the front and none on the rear, its looking for traction, loosen the limiters, tighten the center a little, soften the rear a little,
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800, just got mixed up a little read what he wrote. too much weight on the front.

Don't crank up the center spring more cause that will make it worse.
 
vipertripplexxx said:
800, just got mixed up a little read what he wrote. too much weight on the front.

Don't crank up the center spring more cause that will make it worse.
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So what approach should I take with it? let out the center and tighten the rear spring?
 
xxx you keep calling it black when i say its white i snapped i apoligise for the rude comment.but i still stand on the centre shock failing causing lack of traction whitch in turn causes fish tailing to the extent he is describing.
 
xxx you did notice 800 is saying the opposite of you?yes i did to.some of us morons might know what we are talking about and feel the same way as you when we see bad advise.
 
I too disagree with xxx with losening the center shock. You need to get the skid sitting flat on the ground on a level surface. It is hard for anyone to say losen this or tighten that when none of us know where it is set now. That's like telling a doctor half of your symptoms and expecting a proper cure. Bottom line, if you have too much ski pressure the sled will likely dart quite bad. This is often from not enough down force on the front of the track which WILL make the sled feel squirly and darty. Softening the preload on the center will only apply less pressure which will not help. XXX was right IF you do indeed have too much pressure on the front. It will act like a center point and will pivot and handle poorly. I have found more of a push than a squirlyness with this though.
How does it handle in the turns? This will say a lot. And, when on flat surface does the rear of the track sit up off the ground? I just longed tracked my viper and had a horrible time finding the proper balance. It acts different ways with different set ups.
As for recommending 1/4 in on toe in???? Shouldn't he check where the existing toe in is before adjusting? Maybe it is already set with too much toe. Hope this helps.
 
Almost700 said:
I too disagree with xxx with losening the center shock. You need to get the skid sitting flat on the ground on a level surface. It is hard for anyone to say losen this or tighten that when none of us know where it is set now. That's like telling a doctor half of your symptoms and expecting a proper cure. Bottom line, if you have too much ski pressure the sled will likely dart quite bad. This is often from not enough down force on the front of the track which WILL make the sled feel squirly and darty. Softening the preload on the center will only apply less pressure which will not help. XXX was right IF you do indeed have too much pressure on the front. It will act like a center point and will pivot and handle poorly. I have found more of a push than a squirlyness with this though.
How does it handle in the turns? This will say a lot. And, when on flat surface does the rear of the track sit up off the ground? I just longed tracked my viper and had a horrible time finding the proper balance. It acts different ways with different set ups.
As for recommending 1/4 in on toe in???? Shouldn't he check where the existing toe in is before adjusting? Maybe it is already set with too much toe. Hope this helps.
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You can never have too much toe...know the toe LOL! Seriously though lets not confuse this guy any more than he already is. Noone recommended toe in...800 recommended checking that it's 1/4" toed out. I bump a 6' level (straight machined edge) against my track and measure toe out from the front of the carbide to the back and toe it out 1/8" on each side. Skis sometimes have different width front to rear so I never measure from edge of skis. Always worked for me no darting issues no duallys and no shims.
As for the unstable sled at high speed listen to Almost700 advice to get your rear suspension balanced.
 
Thanks guys... The sled seems to handle okay in the turns (nothing unusual). As far as the track on flat ground, the rear is off of the ground. I'd say the last 6" or so sits up off the ground. From what I remember, the rear shock is set pretty far out and the center is about in the middle. For what it's worth, my front shocks are set at the softest setting.

THe skis have never been touched and are set at the factory settings (800 miles on sled)

I'll double check the current settings on the rears and post them.

Thanks again!
 
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I will bet when you set your sled on a level floor, you are going to see the rear of the track wont touch the floor. Then you will need to most likely adjust the rear suspension sucking up the front (adjust straps and maybe loosen the spring) and pushing down on the rear (or tighten the spring)

800 quote:
however if the back end is wandering its because there is too much weight on the front and none on the rear, its looking for traction, loosen the limiters, tighten the center a little, soften the rear a little,
800 ? want more weight on the rear I agree but how will tighten the front and loosening the rear spring do that other then weight transfer?
would not it be better to let the limiters set the fra softer and set the rear spring a little stiffer to get it to plant when just crusing.

you know there are just lots of ways to get there, just want to be there when done. ( more than one way to skin a cat )
 
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He's not talking about darting, he's talking about the rear of the sled kicking around. Two totally different things! I'm waiting for 800 to say he had it backwards when he said to tighten the center preload up. I think he was refering to tightening up the front limiter, and releasing the rear limiter. But usually its just a spring preload ajustment. Also if your front springs are set to soft this to can cause the front of the track to have to much pressure. 800 had it right when he said there was to much weight on the front, not enough on the rear of the track. So how can turning up the front skid shock help? it won't! It will just put more pressure up on the front of the track, and take more off the rear of the track. This type of problem is most pronounced in lose snow conditions, unlike darting which is usually worse in hardpack. Bottom line the center shock will tell you what to do try turning it up and see if the problem gets worse/better.
 
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