some results on the HC setups...still need more top end speed

bluemonster1

bluemonster1

LIFE MEMBER ONLY ONCE!!!
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Howden ,Manitoba,Canada
Well I have been testing with my HC's for the past few days.I took out the 14.5 rollers and went back to 15.6 rollers.

SET UP #1> 5 grams in heel....7 grams in tip....total weight was 63.4 grams.
I will launch at 4200 rpm and goes up to 8500 and then drops to 8200 WOT for a speed of 104 mph. I am using a 50/38 helix wrapped at 70 here.

SET UP #2> 5.4 grams in heel...6.1 grams in tip..total weight was 62.8 grams.Under a good launch with traction goes to 8100-8200 rpm and climbs to 8500 at WOT.Just a little over 100mph again.Same helix and wrap.

SET UP #3> This time using 15mm rollers. 5.4g heel and 6.1g in tip.Same helix and wrap.engages at 4200 ,goes to 8500 at launch and WOT was 8800 and not really any better on speed,about 100 mph today.It was a little warmer and the snow more sugar.Hard to get a good launch on the river,because I just spin the hell out of the track right to the ice and just basically sit there revving it out like a chainsaw.

SET UP #4> 15mm rollers again,5.4g heel,7.0 g in tip. If I find a good base to launch from,basically launches to 8000-8100 and climbs to 8600 and down to 8500 WOT.Again lucky to hit 100 mph.

So I can't seem to get my top end speed up.I was thinking that conditions are icy and a little loose.Maybe I should try going to 80 wrap and see what gives.Maybe my belt is slipping at 70.Clutches are cool.Put new belt in,broke it in properly up to 50 miles on it first before I started to give her hell.
I am stumped here.THOUGHT that I should be reaching speeds of 110 to 115 at least on wide open runs.It has been a crappy winter and conditions haven't been the best.It seems to me I was doing a little better with the 15.6 rollers If I drop some of my heel weight,does my wot rpm go up slightly,and I could just add more to tip.Today seems like it got to 100mph and rpms are spot on,but not climbing on the mph.Ieven went on the middle of the river where there was more loose snow,and I couldn't get more then 80 mph then.
Last year with the 8DN-20's loaded up and 51/43 helix at 80,with a 144 studded track and a skid that was falling apart in places..I was doing 110 and still climbing on the speedo.Like if I was at 100mph steady,then pushed throttle more,needle just started to climb instantly..but I had to let go because of the corner coming up.I am a little disappointed here.
What I need is to find a good packed base to launch from,but nothing around.You either dig down to the grass or the ice and just over spin the clutches.But there where a couple of times when she dug in and man did it ever launch hard and fast and the ski's pulled up and I hung on.Just wanna know why I am not hitting speeds the guys on here say they are hitting typically..110.115...120 mph on a constant basis.PV's are clean and adjusted,transfer is set at 50/50 on the rods.Limiter straps are not pulled to tight.Any suggestions guys.
HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

just putting this out there rap it at 60

also have you checked for other things that are causing you drag.

check all your bearings, on wheels and chaincase and jack and drive.

Your clutch's are clean and in good shape nor worn.

run syn atf in your chain case. Is your track to tight ect...
 
this sled has been all worked on this past summer.Replaced the skid and has all new bearings thru out this sled.Track is 1.5" sag at 22 lbs which is loose enough.Compression is equal across all 3 cylinders at 120.PV's completely cleaned and adjusted a couple of weekends ago.Brand new Predator 1" 6 pitch track also,no studs.Clutch is in great shape also.Carbs are cleaned out properly also.Got 01 jetting and 47.5 pilots installed.I will check on the weekend to make sure the servo motor is working,or during the week if I have time to,that is a must for sure.I have a spare clutch with the 8DN-20's all set up,I should just put it in to see if there is any difference in the speed.I could take the 51/43 helix from my other sled and try that combo.
 
why are you running 47.5 pilots.

Are you running a new belt, if so was it cleaned and broken in properly. Have you changed anything else when you did the switch. like low windy, new skis. ect..
 
using 47.5 pilots to eliminate low end bog.When using HC's,they tend to load the motor more,so have to increase pilots to get it to jump when I snap the throttle.I put on new Simmon's ski's also.Did the alignment and camber thing also.Toe out is just slightly about 1/8".Camber is at 0.Also shimmed the ski's to get them to sit back on the rear of the carbides more.These ski's have dual carbides which really bit on the ice and snow.I could set my limiters a little looser,now they are about 3/4" from thread end to the back of the first nut.With maximun perf. transfer rods,I have about 4 lines showing yet.I set the rods up that when I sit on the sled,I have a 50/50 spacing on the top and bottom of the washers(spacers).
 
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im still fighting the same thing as you blu, im running pretty mutch the same setup you are. 4.8g in heel 7.6g in tip ( i changed to a 22 gear in the chaincase, stock is 23 and had to add 1gram more on the tip, 23 gear i was at 6.6g in the tip) my sled pulls very hard on the bottom but not on the top. i went testing on thursday and it was reallly harpack, i hit 115 for the first time this year revving 8600 (never hit more than 100 with the 23 gear) helix is 51/37 wrapped at 60. Now we had a big snowstorm and theres alot of loose snow in the trails, went out and it was overeving like crazy 8900 on the get go and then back to 8100 to start climbing slowly back. tried wrap at 80, calmed things down, went to 8600 on the snap, then down to 8300 to climb slowly back. could only get 90 top speed!!! even my buddy with a bone stock 99 srx passesd my like i was stopped at 80 #$%&* my sled has been gone thru everything too, track i as loose as i can without ratcheting, bearings are new everywhere, pv's are clean, syn atf in the chaincase. Sometimes im tempted to scrap the hc,s too and put the 8dn setup, i also have it here lying around, but im not a quitter, don and the others swear by it and i belive them, im just clueless, 90 on the speedo yesterday and getting stomped by the stock srx got me really pissed off :o| i was the laughing stuff of the day.

humm i was thinking, how mutch clearance is there between the front heat exchanger protectors and the stock track? stock track is 3/4 and the heat exchanger protectors are 1inch thick

i have a hacksaw on mine 1inch lugs and the stock pretectors where rubbing on it, i have custom 3/4inch protectors on it now and there is 1/4 clearance between them and the track, i just installed them before my ride yesterday, didnt have any before and my 1.175 studs(96) where starting to do a nice job on my exchanger. could it be i dont have enough clearance? i dont think so anyways it will only rub when you let go of the gas no?
 
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maybe your scrubbing off speed by having the track too loose, they do balloon out the faster you go, when they rub they rub up under the gastank area, this is where the ripple forms. the track is being pulled down from the drivers and then it bunches up before the drivers again, you add studs to it makes it even worse as the heavierthetrack the more this happens. Try tightening up the track and see if you pick up mph, I bet your rubbing the track under the gastank area, its like running with the brake on. Clutching set up sounds fine, I dont think your problem is there.
 
also like i stated i have 1/4 clearance between the heat exchanger protectors and the track, i have added them just before my last ride, could that be the probem? sled never ran so slow than that time, i think stock thats what the clearance is. i have protectors riveted under the tunnel, always been there, studs where rubbing in the exchanger and on the bump on top of the exchanger if thats what you call the gas thank area. Maybe i dont have enough clearance between the protectors and the track would really make sense.!
 
Thanks mrviper for the track tip!
Will try, I am only getting like 108 mph on mine regularly.. 112 was the best reading on the dream o meter. 1,25 track.
 
if you take a mechanics mirror on a stick and stick it up by the front drive axle, you can see if the track has rubbed the top of the tunnel under the gastank! the white stock protectors will be black and the tunnel will have scrape marks from the studs gouging it.

I once had this 01srx in here and it was studded with 192 studs, same thing guy complained no top speed. Up on a jackstand had a good 2 inchs of sag under the hyfax, took sled for a test,didnt rachetthetrack but was flat feeling up top. Took out the skid and I was shocked that the track had eaten completely thru the tunnel and was gouging out the black plastic of the fuel tank bottom, imagine if he would have gone a little further down the lake wide open......lol!! track was too loose, ballooning up and gouging out the tunnel, he said he never felt a thing, just seemd down on speed, I bet it was.......LOL :rofl:
 
well my old track,the stocker had 144 suds on it and I was get tunnel marks also and was cutting at the front exchanger fins.So removed the track and went with 1" Predator 6-pitch track with no studs.I will tighten up the track somemore.Someone on her,I think it was Valin or bluewho..can't remember,said that we shouldn't run the track that loose.Said when we sit on the sled,everything compress's and the track gets looser by that alone.So better having track tighter.Just wandering,if you go to a 60 wrap,less spring pressure..but will the belt not slip a lot more under heavy launches and wot.
I will switch to my spare clutch and set up the heelclickers again and see if there is any difference at all between the 2 clutch's.
 
Weird. My heelclickers are set up a lot lighter (about 4 grams heel 5 grams tip) less helix (52/36 microbelmont) with green spring at 70 and i'm hitting the same rpm as you are, but getting a bit better top speed. toping out at 110-112 mph on a hard packed road. My problem is my heelclickers are eating belts in anything but trail conditions where they run completely cool on the trail. Hope you figure out your situation... mine has me puzzled lol.
 
well i did check my white plastic protectors under the tunnel and your right don, they are black from rubbing under the gas tank. i dont have acces to a mirror now, il bring one from work thursday to have a look. Now on the otherhand my track is pretty tight, even my buddy saw it today when he came over while i was going to change the hifax's, said it was too tight, i cant run it very loose or it will ratchet. i checked my front exchanger protectors, and i didnt see any black marks on them. My question remains, i have about 1/4 of clearance between them and the track, is that enough or is that robbing me speed? my studs (1.175,track is 1inch) where about 1/2 from hitting the excahnger when i put them in. I didnt have any front exchanger potectors before (put them in 3 days ago), and now my exchanger is eaten about 1/8 deep where the studs are in the track. Thats making me think my exchanger protectors i just put in are too thick and i dont have enough clearance, everybody around here says 1/4 is more than enough. As ive said, i hit 115 on hardpack and 90 2 days after when there was loose stuff in the trails (the groomer had passes but the snow was pretty soft) the only change i did between these 2 days was ad the protectors,they must be the culprit no?
 
and your sled is ported yet,you should be hitting 120 at least then.I am stumped with me set-up.I think I will try my 8DN setup again,was doing better top end with them last year.Maybe the HC's won't work for every situation and was money wasted for me.
 
if theres no marks on the guards then its not rubbing there, where its black its rubbing. gonna have alot to do with how the skid is set up, if its not correct the track is gonna seem tight on a jackstand but when your on the gas and the weight is transferred and plus your weight on top of tunnel put back on it, it sags the track,presto balloon track eating away at the top of the tunnel, just like riding with the brake on. you have something going on there with it, if its rubbing the tunnel its too loose!
 
I really am stumped because when I had my 81 440 SRX years back,all stock..I was hitting 115 on the speedo..and that's a twin with less HP.My 440 exciter was doing 95 and my 2001 SXR600 was topping out at 100 mph on good days to.So the SRX is not doing it for me now and am disappointed in that.I know for sure that my brake is not dragging because with my sled up on a stand,new belt..track is jerking forward.My clutches were all aligned and centered last summer also.Everything was done that possibly be done to get the sled tuned.Maybe putting studs on the track gives it more rotating mass which actually propels the sled easier.I also have oversized Polaris idler wheels,marginal wheel kit,new graphite hyfax which are holding up really good with minimal wear even in this low snow condition this season.How can one check to see how much ski pressure one has.My limiters are not even pulled up tight,which would put more pressure on ski's.
When my sled is up on the stand and I adjust my limiters,they are tight..basically holding the rails in certain position.When I let sled down,with full weight of sled and track sitting on floor,the limiter straps go loose.Is this the way they should be.It is when I sit on the sled and give it throttle that the sled will rock back..the limiter straps will then tighten as they should?
 
well begininng of season i ran it alot looser because i was not studded, since im studded i had to run it alot tighter because it would ratchet now. so it might have rubbed the tunned only before, ill know more when i look with a mirror to see if my studs marked the tunnel, the plastic protectors are about 1/2 thick if i remember correctly, and my studs protrude the track about 1/2, so should be close! im going to remove my front protectors anyways and go back testing to see, its only 4 rivets. As ive said i had 1/2 clearance between the studs and exchanger before puttting the protectors and it ate about 1/8 of the fins out of the exchanger, so that means to me the track needs about 5/8 clearance to be free. I have now 1/4 between track and protectors, so for sure it has to be braking me , makes sense no? Thanks guys this forum is really helping me learn everyday!
 
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