First would like to say this is my first post on the 2stroke side. Was on the 4stroke side a few years ago back when I owned and modded my 06 Apex. I now mtn ride and own a 15 ski doo. However I randomly picked up a 1999 Yamaha Phazer last week that has no spark, I would like to get it running and keep as a sled for my fiance.
So far I have used this thread as a starting guide, http://www.totallyamaha.net/forums/printthread.php?t=33319
Second, I would say I am a amateur mechanic in that the only reason I work on my own stuff is to save $. I know little to nothing bout electrical stuff, so all this is new to me and I am unfamiliar with electrical terms and parts. However it is my understanding the electrical systems on these older sleds are fairly simple and straight forward. So I look forward to hopefully get in a understanding of how it all works and hopefully in the end get this sled sparking and running again...
So far, I have by passed the tors as seen in the pic below.
Disconnected what I believe to be the kill switch connection under the handlebar pad
I however do not know how to by-pass the key switch?
I have a decent volt meter, I am getting a voltage increase at the spark plug caps when I pull the engine over. However based on the link above when i tried to check the ignition coil secondary resistance as follows:
a. Swich an ohmmeter to the RX100 scale.
b. Measure resistance between the spark plug lead and the the orange wire.
secondary specs. Hitachi coil 2.8-4.2 K ohms
secondary specs. Toyo Denso coil 3.2-4.8 K ohms
While testing this I got no resistance reading at all? So I ordered a new ignition coil, or what I believe is this part...
I will wait until this part arrives most likely and hook it up to see if it fixes the problem before I dig into it anymore.
However a few more questions.
Does anybody have knowledge of where the grounds are on this sled so I can check them? I can only find the ground for the handwarmers, I should also mention I checked the wires for exposed wires/shorts and didnt see anything that I think would cause a short.
Following the wire harness under the hood, one of the connection points there is a 3 pronged plug that is not plugged into anything, is it suppose to be like this or should it be plugged into something? (sorry for blurry pic)
My last question, under the handle bar pad and the wires/connection I am holding onto in this pic (sorry for blurry pic)
Does this look ok? I have no idea what this connection is suppose to be, but based on how it looks I am hoping it does not do anything important??? The bottom two "wires" are an elastic material that dont go anywhere and arent able to carry any electric through them? Basically this connection has only 1 wire that could be of importance so I am hoping this connection is not needed for the sled to run?
Thanks in advance for any help
So far I have used this thread as a starting guide, http://www.totallyamaha.net/forums/printthread.php?t=33319
Second, I would say I am a amateur mechanic in that the only reason I work on my own stuff is to save $. I know little to nothing bout electrical stuff, so all this is new to me and I am unfamiliar with electrical terms and parts. However it is my understanding the electrical systems on these older sleds are fairly simple and straight forward. So I look forward to hopefully get in a understanding of how it all works and hopefully in the end get this sled sparking and running again...
So far, I have by passed the tors as seen in the pic below.
Disconnected what I believe to be the kill switch connection under the handlebar pad
I however do not know how to by-pass the key switch?
I have a decent volt meter, I am getting a voltage increase at the spark plug caps when I pull the engine over. However based on the link above when i tried to check the ignition coil secondary resistance as follows:
a. Swich an ohmmeter to the RX100 scale.
b. Measure resistance between the spark plug lead and the the orange wire.
secondary specs. Hitachi coil 2.8-4.2 K ohms
secondary specs. Toyo Denso coil 3.2-4.8 K ohms
While testing this I got no resistance reading at all? So I ordered a new ignition coil, or what I believe is this part...
I will wait until this part arrives most likely and hook it up to see if it fixes the problem before I dig into it anymore.
However a few more questions.
Does anybody have knowledge of where the grounds are on this sled so I can check them? I can only find the ground for the handwarmers, I should also mention I checked the wires for exposed wires/shorts and didnt see anything that I think would cause a short.
Following the wire harness under the hood, one of the connection points there is a 3 pronged plug that is not plugged into anything, is it suppose to be like this or should it be plugged into something? (sorry for blurry pic)
My last question, under the handle bar pad and the wires/connection I am holding onto in this pic (sorry for blurry pic)
Does this look ok? I have no idea what this connection is suppose to be, but based on how it looks I am hoping it does not do anything important??? The bottom two "wires" are an elastic material that dont go anywhere and arent able to carry any electric through them? Basically this connection has only 1 wire that could be of importance so I am hoping this connection is not needed for the sled to run?
Thanks in advance for any help
second picture, the connection in the bottom of the pic in the middle, is plugged in fyi. Just unplugged it and replugged it to make sure it was connected correctly...
super1c
Super Moderator
Wow awesome post, sorry I'm not any help. But will bump it to the top for one of the phazer guys.
YooperWoods
New member
If you had no resistance in the coil then it's open and bad. Get your new coil in and retest, and yes that is the coil in your pic.
It did show resistance when I tested the resistance between the orange input wire and ground, but no resistance between the spark plug cap and the orange wire. I have a new one on the way, will know by monday the latest if that fixes the issue
UT_Grandpa
New member
On an ignition coil there are two circuits: One for the pulsed low voltage from the CDI and the other that connects to the two sparkplugs. You should be able to get a resistance check between the two spark plug wires at about 15K Ohms (15000 Ohms). Each sparkplug cap is about 5,000 Ohms and the coil is about another 5000 Ohms. The primary side is checked from the orange wire to the ground on the coil - where the unit bolts on the engine. It should be almost 0 Ohms (actually the repair manual says 0.2 Ohms.
All of the wires have to be connected or you won't get power to the CDI/Coil. The kill switch, ignition switch, throttle safety switch, the switch on the carbs all have to be working.
Good luck.
All of the wires have to be connected or you won't get power to the CDI/Coil. The kill switch, ignition switch, throttle safety switch, the switch on the carbs all have to be working.
Good luck.
Welcome and good luck. Don't let the electrics intimidate you. These sleds are very simple and easy to diagnose.
Go ahead and test your stator while you are at it. You can do all of the phazer electric tests in a matter of a few minutes (experienced) or half hour (newbie). Focus on the ones that make it run first including the key switch. I presume that you have the service manual right?
Now for your questions . . .
Go ahead and test your stator while you are at it. You can do all of the phazer electric tests in a matter of a few minutes (experienced) or half hour (newbie). Focus on the ones that make it run first including the key switch. I presume that you have the service manual right?
Now for your questions . . .
- The side of the TORS connection that goes back to the harness is the only one you need to connect for bypassing. In any case it should still run even if the switches are bad. I would reconnect it as it is a safety feature.
- Some times the primary coli wire breaks at the coil or somewhere along the wire. This is usually found by a point in the wire that bends far too easily indicating the wire inside is broken. You have a new one coming, so that should eliminate that. The primary wire is the orange one coming out of the bottom of the coil that goes into a bullet connector similar to the TORS connectors.
- I advise against attempting to test a coil output by turning it over. Bad things can happen to you and your meter. Your plug caps should be 5K ohm so either take that into consideration or remove them to test.
- The triangle shaped connector has the kill switch and the throttle switch connections. Test your kill switch and if good reconnect it.
- Don't worry about bypassing the key switch. Just find the connector (along the steering gate) disconnect and using an ohmeter test each key position to ensure that the right pins get connected. Use a #3 Phillips screwdriver to free the cowling to the right of the key switch. The connector is under this.
- Chassis ground is on the left side of the steering gate toward the top near the bend. Might be another one, but can't recall at the moment . . .
- The flat connector is for your thumb warmer - not needed to start
- The capped connector near the recoil is normal for a non-electric start model. This is where the sub-harness connects for electric start models.
- I will mention again to test, test, test and save yourself a lot of time and headache. Start with the stator. You have to generate power for anything to work.
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So I got the sled running, I replaced the stator and the igntion coil. It was the stator that turned out to be bad.
However another issue has arrived!
Rode it twice so far. First ride I rode it about 20 mins, took a long break then it would only started running on one cylinder (only sparking in one cylinder).
Got home, put the original ignition coil back in and it started and ran perfect on the first pull.
Second ride out, rode it about 20 mins, ran perfect. Took the first longer break of the day, and the sled would only run on one cylinder after that. Whats going on???
So some opinions of mine. Something seems to be screwing with the igntion coil now, what could it be? I have a new iginition coil on the way, and new voltage regulator, figure maybe the voltage reg is bad and is messing with the igntino coil over time.
In my 2 rides out, the sled has not stopped getting spark on the first time I shut it off, but on the first time I shut it off for a while (~10 mins or more). Sled runs perfect up to this point.
My plan is to re inspect all wiring, replace voltage reg, and igntion coil then test again. Which probably wont be till next year sometime... Anybody have any other ideas that I am looking over?
However another issue has arrived!
Rode it twice so far. First ride I rode it about 20 mins, took a long break then it would only started running on one cylinder (only sparking in one cylinder).
Got home, put the original ignition coil back in and it started and ran perfect on the first pull.
Second ride out, rode it about 20 mins, ran perfect. Took the first longer break of the day, and the sled would only run on one cylinder after that. Whats going on???
So some opinions of mine. Something seems to be screwing with the igntion coil now, what could it be? I have a new iginition coil on the way, and new voltage regulator, figure maybe the voltage reg is bad and is messing with the igntino coil over time.
In my 2 rides out, the sled has not stopped getting spark on the first time I shut it off, but on the first time I shut it off for a while (~10 mins or more). Sled runs perfect up to this point.
My plan is to re inspect all wiring, replace voltage reg, and igntion coil then test again. Which probably wont be till next year sometime... Anybody have any other ideas that I am looking over?
rx1jim
New member
Have you checked the condition of the spark plugs or replaced them? Plugs often get blamed when the real problem is elsewhere but no harm in checking. I reccommend you check all of the connectors to be sure the connections are corrosion-free, including the connections to ground which are usually under the heads of screws/bolts. I had an igntion coil which would fail with an open circuit only once it got warm, as soon as it would cool down, it was fine. Once you get it running fine ( and you will) please reconnect the TORS safety circuit and test it to make sure it works properly. The TORS circuit is an important safety device. Keep on it, you'll find it. Plenty of time now until the next riding season. Good luck!
Jim
Jim
giesregen
New member
1999 Phazer 500 no spark please help?
tkuss, this is my story too! Everything you mention happened to my '99 as well recently. I rode it for 300 miles over Christmas then tried to start it the next day. It acted like I had the kill switch pressed when I tried to start. Absolutely nothing. I bypassed the TORS and put new plugs in and managed to get it started, so I thought I found the issue. To verify, I even plugged the TORS back in and it wouldn't start. So I unplugged the TORS again, started it, rode it a bit, brought it back and started having the same restart issues you mentioned, running on one cylinder, restart after waiting, etc... I replaced the CDI, coil, bypassed TORS, new plugs, checked connections..... I can't explain it
. Did you ever figure it out? I'm guessing at this point I have a bad electrical connection somewhere due to the random nature. I've had this sled for 7 years and have almost 5k on it. It's been very reliable and only recently started misbehaving. Ugggh.
tkuss, this is my story too! Everything you mention happened to my '99 as well recently. I rode it for 300 miles over Christmas then tried to start it the next day. It acted like I had the kill switch pressed when I tried to start. Absolutely nothing. I bypassed the TORS and put new plugs in and managed to get it started, so I thought I found the issue. To verify, I even plugged the TORS back in and it wouldn't start. So I unplugged the TORS again, started it, rode it a bit, brought it back and started having the same restart issues you mentioned, running on one cylinder, restart after waiting, etc... I replaced the CDI, coil, bypassed TORS, new plugs, checked connections..... I can't explain it
. Did you ever figure it out? I'm guessing at this point I have a bad electrical connection somewhere due to the random nature. I've had this sled for 7 years and have almost 5k on it. It's been very reliable and only recently started misbehaving. Ugggh.