I am so disappointed in my 'new to me' sled after having driven some 10+ hours on the PO's word that 'I wouldn't be disappointed.'
So far I have found the chain tension to be so lose that I'm surprised it didn't grenade. The reverse pinion gear is showing some tooth decay, but I gave it all a thorough cleaning, fresh fluids, bit of Lucas additive, and set the tension correctly.
The ring gear had previously come off the primary the the PO had replaced it but failed to loctite the fasteners in place so a few hours of driving and it's already lose, hence this post.
I've got the primary off now. Keep in mind that I have a receipt here dated Feb 2016 for a so-called rebuilt clutch from a certain Ontario northernish sled parts recycler. $375 plus tax. It was not installed until the summer and has essentially no miles.
Even before the newly installed ring gear started loosening up, it was noisy at idle/low revs. It quieted up under load and was told by the PO not to worry about it.
Upon dismantling, there is play in both bushings in the primary sheave and sheave cap. I would say I can wobble the assembly about 1/8" measured from the outer edge of the components. To me that seems a little sloppy for a bushing on a shaft.
The sliders actually appear newish, but I don't know. wobbling side to side there seems to be a fair bit of play, but from a rotational twisting aspect, there is very little play.
I've attached pics of the weights. I think the rattle is coming from the weights hitting the rollers at idle on/off as it rotates. You can see there is a little groove there. I would have tought at rest that the weights would rest on the rollers to eliminate this noise, but mine have a significant gap....maybe 1/8"? My sons 600 Vmax make no such noise.
The spring is black and has no paint mark on it.
I've read the 'new to me toy' thread (http://www.totallyamaha.net/forums/showthread.php/100301-New-to-me-toy/page9) and he says about 48g would be a good setup for the 700 Venture I own. My machine is easily getting up over 9000 rpm before the load catches up to it.
There is also some play on the weight itself to the shaft it rides on, probably about 20-30 though measured at the tip. Seems like a lot.
So in a poorly written way, I'm wondering if all this slop is normal acceptable limits or if the PO was duped into buying a POS clutch and I have to do a full rebuild. I'm wondering if the play in the weight-to-roller at idle and the associated noise is acceptable. I'm wondering if going from 45 to 48 grams on the weights is going to get me back down to 8500 rpms max when accelerating. I've been told the aftermarket kits are crap and I need to stick with Yamaha parts? Is the black spring OEM or some other abortion - Yamaha parts says it should be a pink spring for the 700.
Your thoughts and advice are appreciated.
So far I have found the chain tension to be so lose that I'm surprised it didn't grenade. The reverse pinion gear is showing some tooth decay, but I gave it all a thorough cleaning, fresh fluids, bit of Lucas additive, and set the tension correctly.
The ring gear had previously come off the primary the the PO had replaced it but failed to loctite the fasteners in place so a few hours of driving and it's already lose, hence this post.
I've got the primary off now. Keep in mind that I have a receipt here dated Feb 2016 for a so-called rebuilt clutch from a certain Ontario northernish sled parts recycler. $375 plus tax. It was not installed until the summer and has essentially no miles.
Even before the newly installed ring gear started loosening up, it was noisy at idle/low revs. It quieted up under load and was told by the PO not to worry about it.
Upon dismantling, there is play in both bushings in the primary sheave and sheave cap. I would say I can wobble the assembly about 1/8" measured from the outer edge of the components. To me that seems a little sloppy for a bushing on a shaft.
The sliders actually appear newish, but I don't know. wobbling side to side there seems to be a fair bit of play, but from a rotational twisting aspect, there is very little play.
I've attached pics of the weights. I think the rattle is coming from the weights hitting the rollers at idle on/off as it rotates. You can see there is a little groove there. I would have tought at rest that the weights would rest on the rollers to eliminate this noise, but mine have a significant gap....maybe 1/8"? My sons 600 Vmax make no such noise.
The spring is black and has no paint mark on it.
I've read the 'new to me toy' thread (http://www.totallyamaha.net/forums/showthread.php/100301-New-to-me-toy/page9) and he says about 48g would be a good setup for the 700 Venture I own. My machine is easily getting up over 9000 rpm before the load catches up to it.
There is also some play on the weight itself to the shaft it rides on, probably about 20-30 though measured at the tip. Seems like a lot.
So in a poorly written way, I'm wondering if all this slop is normal acceptable limits or if the PO was duped into buying a POS clutch and I have to do a full rebuild. I'm wondering if the play in the weight-to-roller at idle and the associated noise is acceptable. I'm wondering if going from 45 to 48 grams on the weights is going to get me back down to 8500 rpms max when accelerating. I've been told the aftermarket kits are crap and I need to stick with Yamaha parts? Is the black spring OEM or some other abortion - Yamaha parts says it should be a pink spring for the 700.
Your thoughts and advice are appreciated.
Vincent
New member
Looks and sounds like your clutch needs an overhaul.
Yes adding three grams to the tips of your weights will drop some revs, but i suggest you service both your clutches first.
Yes adding three grams to the tips of your weights will drop some revs, but i suggest you service both your clutches first.
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I totally agree that the clutches need to be serviced.
Is it normal for the weights to clatter like that at idle because my son's 600 VMax does not do that.
Is it normal for the weights to clatter like that at idle because my son's 600 VMax does not do that.
I totally agree that the clutches need to be serviced.
Is it normal for the weights to clatter like that at idle because my son's 600 VMax does not do that.
Is it normal for the weights to clatter like that at idle because my son's 600 VMax does not do that.
Vincent
New member
No its not normal. Something is really worn out for sure.
The only noise I ever heard was from
before I rebuilt my clutchs the shafts that the rollers are on would just pass the spider assembly a bit. Even with the bolts tighten up you could always slide the shafts back and forth about 1/16. You could here it a bit of a clang on idle cause of it. It never damaged anything.
Now that my clutch got a complete overhaul its quiet.
The only noise I ever heard was from
before I rebuilt my clutchs the shafts that the rollers are on would just pass the spider assembly a bit. Even with the bolts tighten up you could always slide the shafts back and forth about 1/16. You could here it a bit of a clang on idle cause of it. It never damaged anything.
Now that my clutch got a complete overhaul its quiet.
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OK, good to know. I have kits coming in for both clutches, new rivets with the intention of adding weight, and even picked up a little scale to get the weights bang on. Thanks.
A couple of bucks
VIP Member
Closely inspect that clutch for wear and slop. Or else it'll look like Devins.
At 8500 rpms, that clutch should be cruising somewhere @ 280 mph. This is assuming that approximently 30 rpms = 1 mph.
Here is my scale,
https://www.ebay.com/itm/361648035186
At 8500 rpms, that clutch should be cruising somewhere @ 280 mph. This is assuming that approximently 30 rpms = 1 mph.
Here is my scale,
https://www.ebay.com/itm/361648035186
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Will do.
The weather was great today so we did do a little run. Funny enough I had no noise whatsoever with the ring gear off the primary, so the noise that I thought was coming from the flyweights was just the ring gear all along. So I have six new screws coming in and will loctite them into place. The holes have opened up just ever so much and the outside edge of the inner sheave is slightly rubbed down from the ring gear moving, so I am going to set it up in my lathe and shim and indicate it before I torque the screws down. Hopefully it holds, but if not I will have to replace both items sadly.
The weather was great today so we did do a little run. Funny enough I had no noise whatsoever with the ring gear off the primary, so the noise that I thought was coming from the flyweights was just the ring gear all along. So I have six new screws coming in and will loctite them into place. The holes have opened up just ever so much and the outside edge of the inner sheave is slightly rubbed down from the ring gear moving, so I am going to set it up in my lathe and shim and indicate it before I torque the screws down. Hopefully it holds, but if not I will have to replace both items sadly.
Well I turned some thick washers out on the lathe to match the Dalton medium length steel rivets that I picked up. By the time they were on the flyweights and ground down for clearance, they ended up about 49.25 grams. I also replaced the bushings, buttons, pins, washers, etc and gave it a good bath. The spring is a white-???-white. I don't know the middle colour or if there was one. The primary was set at 6+2. Machine pulls really hard and pretty much won't rev past 8000 with it goosed.
Then I cleaned and rebuilt the secondary and set the spring (green) to 6+1. Now I can get to 8500, which I think is where I want to stop for WOT max revs right?
Then I cleaned and rebuilt the secondary and set the spring (green) to 6+1. Now I can get to 8500, which I think is where I want to stop for WOT max revs right?
Vincent
New member
Yes 8500 rpm is good.
make sure you use 641 on the screws for the ring gear.