baker
New member
Recently bought '94 Vmax 500 with extended track with 1.25" paddles; & a '95 vmax 600 short track with .75" paddles. Both have 2700 miles, both have stock motor, pipe, clutch, suspension.
I have changed oil in chain cases, lubed all points, finger-tightened chain tensioner, checked air filters, checked coolant, and put 60 miles on each.
My tune-up budget for this year is $500, including a primary puller, oil and fuel filters, and skins for the '96. I'll need a few jets, but most of the money will go to clutch parts.
I'm getting 7.5 mpg on both, too smoky especially on the '94, and both drank a quart of oil in 60 miles. I did top-end and midrange ignition-kill-plug-pull tests. Plugs are brown to dark brown; too rich.
So the next step is to take down carbs, clean and rejet, adjust float height, and also lean-up the oil injector a little. I ride 4000' to 7000' in 0° to 30° F; lot's of trails, some huge powder meadows and climbing. For these "family" Yamahas, my priorities are reliability, at least 9mpg fuel economy on the trail, and decent power.
I'm thinking 148 main, maybe 146. I keep hearing that Yam jet specs are "too rich", which makes me want a 146, but there will be some 10 mile meadow rides to town at 4000' in 10° air, and I don't won't to fry 'em.
Rear suspension is fine for now. Maybe mod it next summer.
The '94 clutch has egged rollers. I'll have tools available at the end of the week, but I think it's a safe bet that I need to replace all the wear parts in the primary, and likely the bushings and buttons in the secondary.
I am keeping the stock clutches.
Questions:
1 - Any specific recommendations on main jet / needle height? Change any other carb parts, or just tune with existing pilot and fuel screw?
2 - are clutch-wear-parts interchangeable between my two sleds?
3 - are there any aftermarket suppliers of clutch bushings, rollers, weights, rivets, buttons, or sliders for these sleds? Royal Distr used to sell a tune-up kit for these clutches, but they are sold out and not receiving any more according to their sales dept.
4 - If there are no good aftermarket clutch parts suppliers, who has the best prices on oem Yamaha parts?
5 - I read the clutching setups posted by vmaxjohn ('00 500), srx_ch ('96 600), & SRXdude ('96 600). The setups for the two '96 600's are fairly different (because of elevation?). The '00 500 is similar to srx_ch's 600. Are my 94 and 95 clutches the same as the 96 and 00 clutches described in the tech pages. If some of you mid-90's tech guys could jump in here, I would be very grateful.
Primary - Either I use standard weights and rivets and just replace all the bushings and rollers and sliders, or I spend more $$$ to get 8ab-00 with 2.4 rivet in the heel and GPG as a starting point. If so, what tip rivet and how many shims? Your advice?
Secondary - either replace buttons and bushings and spring, or change to a different helix and spring. Your advice? Where do I find these different helixes?
6 - I know nothing about tracks. But it's clear from reading this board that I should put a 1.25" paddles on the 600 shortie (prolly this summer). How do you size a track? Where do you buy good used tracks? How much should I expect to pay?
7 - any tips for tuning oil-injectors down without burning up the motor?
Yep, that's a long damn post. Sorry!!!
I'm really grateful for your help!
Happy Holidays!!!
baker
I have changed oil in chain cases, lubed all points, finger-tightened chain tensioner, checked air filters, checked coolant, and put 60 miles on each.
My tune-up budget for this year is $500, including a primary puller, oil and fuel filters, and skins for the '96. I'll need a few jets, but most of the money will go to clutch parts.
I'm getting 7.5 mpg on both, too smoky especially on the '94, and both drank a quart of oil in 60 miles. I did top-end and midrange ignition-kill-plug-pull tests. Plugs are brown to dark brown; too rich.
So the next step is to take down carbs, clean and rejet, adjust float height, and also lean-up the oil injector a little. I ride 4000' to 7000' in 0° to 30° F; lot's of trails, some huge powder meadows and climbing. For these "family" Yamahas, my priorities are reliability, at least 9mpg fuel economy on the trail, and decent power.
I'm thinking 148 main, maybe 146. I keep hearing that Yam jet specs are "too rich", which makes me want a 146, but there will be some 10 mile meadow rides to town at 4000' in 10° air, and I don't won't to fry 'em.
Rear suspension is fine for now. Maybe mod it next summer.
The '94 clutch has egged rollers. I'll have tools available at the end of the week, but I think it's a safe bet that I need to replace all the wear parts in the primary, and likely the bushings and buttons in the secondary.
I am keeping the stock clutches.
Questions:
1 - Any specific recommendations on main jet / needle height? Change any other carb parts, or just tune with existing pilot and fuel screw?
2 - are clutch-wear-parts interchangeable between my two sleds?
3 - are there any aftermarket suppliers of clutch bushings, rollers, weights, rivets, buttons, or sliders for these sleds? Royal Distr used to sell a tune-up kit for these clutches, but they are sold out and not receiving any more according to their sales dept.
4 - If there are no good aftermarket clutch parts suppliers, who has the best prices on oem Yamaha parts?
5 - I read the clutching setups posted by vmaxjohn ('00 500), srx_ch ('96 600), & SRXdude ('96 600). The setups for the two '96 600's are fairly different (because of elevation?). The '00 500 is similar to srx_ch's 600. Are my 94 and 95 clutches the same as the 96 and 00 clutches described in the tech pages. If some of you mid-90's tech guys could jump in here, I would be very grateful.
Primary - Either I use standard weights and rivets and just replace all the bushings and rollers and sliders, or I spend more $$$ to get 8ab-00 with 2.4 rivet in the heel and GPG as a starting point. If so, what tip rivet and how many shims? Your advice?
Secondary - either replace buttons and bushings and spring, or change to a different helix and spring. Your advice? Where do I find these different helixes?
6 - I know nothing about tracks. But it's clear from reading this board that I should put a 1.25" paddles on the 600 shortie (prolly this summer). How do you size a track? Where do you buy good used tracks? How much should I expect to pay?
7 - any tips for tuning oil-injectors down without burning up the motor?
Yep, that's a long damn post. Sorry!!!
I'm really grateful for your help!
Happy Holidays!!!
baker
Buy Yamaha oem parts from the dealer. The rollers are inexpensive. Clutch parts are generally interchangeable between your sleds, For your elevation your jetting sounds way too high. A dealer should be able to look up what you need for that elevation as well as clutching specs. 8ab,s are good on hard pack snow but don,t work that well in higher elevation in deep snow...keep the stock weights.Your elevation pretty well nullifies any low elevation hard pack snow set ups. You might also want to try snowest.com. Lotsa good mountain type info on there & don,t be afraid to ask. Tuff to get info on older sleds sometimes.
baker
New member
Thanks Turk!
From xtremepowersports online fiche:
Roller 8AB-17624-00-00 for the '94 is $15 each.
Roller 8AB-17624-10-00 for the '95 is $32 each.
This is inexpensive?
Yamaha jetting charts from this site say 146 to 151 main jet for my elevation / temps.
This is too high?
I emailed the local dealer today, should have his advise and his parts prices tomorrow.
Thanks for the info on staying away from the 8ab weights at my elevation /snow type.
Anybody else care to chime in?
No sense me re-inventing the wheel when the experience available here can steer me right...
THANKS!!
From xtremepowersports online fiche:
Roller 8AB-17624-00-00 for the '94 is $15 each.
Roller 8AB-17624-10-00 for the '95 is $32 each.
This is inexpensive?
Yamaha jetting charts from this site say 146 to 151 main jet for my elevation / temps.
This is too high?
I emailed the local dealer today, should have his advise and his parts prices tomorrow.
Thanks for the info on staying away from the 8ab weights at my elevation /snow type.
Anybody else care to chime in?
No sense me re-inventing the wheel when the experience available here can steer me right...
THANKS!!
If I remember correctly, somebody was reworking the oil pumps on that era of sled. Seems that Yamaha set them up at a 20:1 ratio from the Factory. I think this company took those pumps and changed the orfice size inside. Can't remember if it was bender or not though. Someone else should remember.
OZ
yes but...
These sleds are hard on both fuel and oil. I was formerly srx_eh which I believe you quoted in your thread. When I was running my Vmax up in the mountains, I ran the clutch settings listed in the tech section with great success, additional settings are as follows;
146.3 mains, stock pilot jets 2 turns out, jet needle @ 1.5, oil pump cable backed off eighth inch, gear ratio @ 1.84, deeper lug track.
146.3 mains, stock pilot jets 2 turns out, jet needle @ 1.5, oil pump cable backed off eighth inch, gear ratio @ 1.84, deeper lug track.
caravanman
New member
I was Bender that did the oil pump reduction repair back in the day. I never had it done.
When I Bought my 95 from Hacker's in Hougton lake (MI) They had the oil pump set up with the cable backed off so the leading edge of the pump lever lined up with the mark on the pump.
The 95 has always gotten a min of 10 MPH and as high as 13 MPH.
My 96 has a thinner 95 head gasket and different pilots with the stock mains and get the same MPG. with the same oil pump cable adjustment both machines use just under one Qt of oil per tank of fuel.
If you can live with 1 inch track for your 95, you can get a used Viper one cheap from other members here on the site.
A XT skid would be a nice upgrade when you are ready.
The roller prices are the same/best i could find as well. The 96 and newer rollers are available in a set of 3 for about $50 but will not fit due to the larger pin size 8mm VS 9MM
. If your roller are good and just the bushings are worn you can get just the bushings, about $12 each.
When I Bought my 95 from Hacker's in Hougton lake (MI) They had the oil pump set up with the cable backed off so the leading edge of the pump lever lined up with the mark on the pump.
The 95 has always gotten a min of 10 MPH and as high as 13 MPH.
My 96 has a thinner 95 head gasket and different pilots with the stock mains and get the same MPG. with the same oil pump cable adjustment both machines use just under one Qt of oil per tank of fuel.
If you can live with 1 inch track for your 95, you can get a used Viper one cheap from other members here on the site.
A XT skid would be a nice upgrade when you are ready.
The roller prices are the same/best i could find as well. The 96 and newer rollers are available in a set of 3 for about $50 but will not fit due to the larger pin size 8mm VS 9MM
. If your roller are good and just the bushings are worn you can get just the bushings, about $12 each.Attachments
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baker
New member
Thank guys! 
Check out this conversion kit for Yam clutches:
http://www.hiperf.com/acatalog/Online_Catalog_Cam_Arms_182.html
Scroll to bottom of page, look at weight conversion kit.
It lets you put any Polaris or AC weight in a Yam clutch. It basically gets rid of the Yam collar by replacing it with a fatter bolt.
They also sell a Thunder Shift kit right above it = adjustable weights.
Total cost of Conversion + Thunder kits = about the same as cost of new Yam weights + collars + bolts + washers + nuts.
Caravanman - I wonder if I bought two Conversion kits, could I then run newer Yam rollers you mentioned, or maybe even Polaris or A.C. rollers?
For '94 & '95, does anyone know OD and ID specs for bushed YAM rollers?
From my 2nd post on this thread, there are two diff part numbers for '94 and '95 rollers, but the bolts and collars and washers for these machines are the same. What is the actual diff in the rollers, other than one cost $15 and the other costs $32??
If the only difference is OD, then a guy could buy the cheaper roller and then make-up the force difference with an adjustable weight system.
I'll call hiperf and talk to them about this; post what I find out.
Keep it coming...
Thanks!
Check out this conversion kit for Yam clutches:
http://www.hiperf.com/acatalog/Online_Catalog_Cam_Arms_182.html
Scroll to bottom of page, look at weight conversion kit.
It lets you put any Polaris or AC weight in a Yam clutch. It basically gets rid of the Yam collar by replacing it with a fatter bolt.
They also sell a Thunder Shift kit right above it = adjustable weights.
Total cost of Conversion + Thunder kits = about the same as cost of new Yam weights + collars + bolts + washers + nuts.
Caravanman - I wonder if I bought two Conversion kits, could I then run newer Yam rollers you mentioned, or maybe even Polaris or A.C. rollers?
For '94 & '95, does anyone know OD and ID specs for bushed YAM rollers?
From my 2nd post on this thread, there are two diff part numbers for '94 and '95 rollers, but the bolts and collars and washers for these machines are the same. What is the actual diff in the rollers, other than one cost $15 and the other costs $32??
If the only difference is OD, then a guy could buy the cheaper roller and then make-up the force difference with an adjustable weight system.
I'll call hiperf and talk to them about this; post what I find out.
Keep it coming...
Thanks!
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caravanman
New member
I think you may be able to use the weight pin conversion for the rollers. The weight and roller bolts and sleeves are the same length.
Here is a page showing the 9mm ID rollers sizes.
Here is a page showing the 9mm ID rollers sizes.
HTML:
http://www.maxxperf.com/Clutch_Rollers.htmbaker
New member
Thanks for the roller sizes CMan!
Did'nt have a chance to talk with hiperf today.
OZ - did you ever try going down one size on the pilot jet? Since these sleds are such fuel hogs, and since we're dropping 2.5 sizes on the main, it seems there'd be room for dropping 1 size on the pilot, esp at 4500'+. Any comments?
Thx.
Did'nt have a chance to talk with hiperf today.
OZ - did you ever try going down one size on the pilot jet? Since these sleds are such fuel hogs, and since we're dropping 2.5 sizes on the main, it seems there'd be room for dropping 1 size on the pilot, esp at 4500'+. Any comments?
Thx.
baker
New member
update:
You cannot run the aforemention Weight Conversion + #200 Thunder Shift Kit in YXR clutches because the non-Yam weights are too long and also profiled differently.
Also, the conversion bolts are smaller than a Yam Collar (not larger), so no dice on the 9mm ID roller idea.
I have searched the universe for cheaper clutch rebuilds. They don't exist. The only two options are to pay Yamaha prices , or rob a parts warehouse.
If you guys see me selling bushings and rollers and collars and stuff for cheap next month, you'll know why.
You cannot run the aforemention Weight Conversion + #200 Thunder Shift Kit in YXR clutches because the non-Yam weights are too long and also profiled differently.
Also, the conversion bolts are smaller than a Yam Collar (not larger), so no dice on the 9mm ID roller idea.
I have searched the universe for cheaper clutch rebuilds. They don't exist. The only two options are to pay Yamaha prices , or rob a parts warehouse.
If you guys see me selling bushings and rollers and collars and stuff for cheap next month, you'll know why.
sxrron
New member
95 vmax 600 fuel econ
I had a 94 and 95 vmax 600. I raised the needle one position and the mpg improved by at least 3 and the sleds ran much better. Be sure to check you plugs after a run at mid throttle.
I had a 94 and 95 vmax 600. I raised the needle one position and the mpg improved by at least 3 and the sleds ran much better. Be sure to check you plugs after a run at mid throttle.