10% alcohol or not?

There is no such thing as a free lunch. I.E. less pollutants means less HP, less MPG, don't kid yourself. Ethanol or the E85 is just a feel good fix, not a solution. Hybrid autos create so much pollution while being built that they will never make up for it in their lifetime. The only real solution is going back to horse and buggies as soon as we figure out how to stop horses from farting. Ranting is fun though and does not pollute much..
 
In our home town, an ethanol plant was going to be built, the local farmers were at first glad to hear due to more corn to sell. Once everyone was a little more educated in the production and what it involved, for instance for every one gallon of alcohol being made it take 6.5 gallons of water which come from the underground water supply. This is from the boiling and steaming of the corn ect. Anyway the company was rejected and not given the rights to build the plant.
 
alswagg said:
I remember driving to and from Colorado with my truck a few years ago. I could alway count on getting about 1 to 2 mpg less in Nebraska than I could get in Indiana, Illinois or Iowa. I should have always gotten better due to the extremly flat roads. But, having to use the Ethanol added fuel the engine ran poor and had to use more throttle. It is a standard to jet up when using ethenal, alcohol added fuels. Try to stay away if possible, never put in E85!!!!
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Illinois, Iowa, and Indiana all have e10 ethanol added fuel standard.

I am not trying to be funny (although it is) but maybe you got 1-2 mpg less in Nebraska because the speed limits are higher and you want to get the hell out of there, so you drive faster. On I80 and other big freeways in Nebraska, 75 is the speed limit where it is 65 in the other states.

Look in the new Snowtech and you will see that running E10 (oxygenated gas) is no issue. I know from years of use that E10 is just fine, those that have degrees in such fields prove it as well.
 
alswagg said:
In our home town, an ethanol plant was going to be built, the local farmers were at first glad to hear due to more corn to sell. Once everyone was a little more educated in the production and what it involved, for instance for every one gallon of alcohol being made it take 6.5 gallons of water which come from the underground water supply. This is from the boiling and steaming of the corn ect. Anyway the company was rejected and not given the rights to build the plant.
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I work with companies (our customers) that are in the ethanol business. Many times the communities do not grant the permission to allow ethanol plants to come in due to the smells that they emit. Also, the price of ethanol is not worth the hassle compared to the low price of oil at the moment.

While corn is still being used to make most ethanol, non food sources such as algae are being made into ethanol, and when that gets to be more economical, ethanol production will go up, and more plants will be made. And then those plants will need to buy our Regenerative Thermal Oxidizers to process the NOX that the ethanol plants produce.

read more at www.ethanol.com, or look up some info on our site, http://www.anguil.com/
 
Maine tv news

Interesting story from Maine tv news

BANGOR (NEWS CENTER) -- Snowmobilers in Maine are complaining about a new gas, E10, that is made up of 10% ethanol.
The gas is designed to reduce our dependence on foreign oil. Many, however, say that if the gas sits in the engines of stationary vehicles for too long the ethanol can separate from the gasoline.
"There's a major issue with ethanol in that in as little as ten days ethanol will separate from gas and if you burn straight ethanol in a snowmobile or a lawnmower or something like that you're going to cook the engine on it," said Lt. Pat Dorian with the Maine Warden Service.
In addition, with the Maine weather, wardens warn that condensation can also be problematic with the E10 gas. Water can absorb the ethanol and ruin the engines of snowmobiles.
Wardens are suggesting snowmobilers use an additive that will prevent water from getting mixed with the gas.
Snowmobile stores are saying that many additives are selling out because of the E10 gas problem.
 
otis700 said:
Interesting story from Maine tv news

BANGOR (NEWS CENTER) -- Snowmobilers in Maine are complaining about a new gas, E10, that is made up of 10% ethanol.
The gas is designed to reduce our dependence on foreign oil. Many, however, say that if the gas sits in the engines of stationary vehicles for too long the ethanol can separate from the gasoline.
"There's a major issue with ethanol in that in as little as ten days ethanol will separate from gas and if you burn straight ethanol in a snowmobile or a lawnmower or something like that you're going to cook the engine on it," said Lt. Pat Dorian with the Maine Warden Service.
In addition, with the Maine weather, wardens warn that condensation can also be problematic with the E10 gas. Water can absorb the ethanol and ruin the engines of snowmobiles.
Wardens are suggesting snowmobilers use an additive that will prevent water from getting mixed with the gas.
Snowmobile stores are saying that many additives are selling out because of the E10 gas problem.
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The wardens are incorrect.
They need to read up on E10. We have used it for 15+ years here in Wisconsin with no issues. When e10 was first brought here, many had the smae "issues" that the Mainer's speak of. These issues were dispelled as myths.
 
I wonder why there is a sudden surge of engines blowing up around here in Maine (myself being one). Brand new sleds are going down at such a rate that several dealers are busy as can be with rebuilds. And, several sleds that have never had a problem in as many as 1000-2000 miles+ are suddenly going down. Say what you want. Not all these sleds are tampered with. Many have just pulled them out of storage as they have year after year, done the typical maintainence, run them, put gas in and boom! It is very ironic that this is happening and the only thing that has changed around here is the gas. Myth or no myth.
 
I'm not sure about the ethonal hurting the engines themselves but it sure does hurt your fuel lines (rotting them out) and it looses octane alot faster when stored
 
I know a local small engine repair shop who's business has increased because of FUEL (aka E10) related problems!

My vote gets cast for REAL Gasoline!!

Contact a fuel distributer and inquire if its available and buy it by the barrel.

just my 02 cents (but it's your motor)

At the very least, do NOT store your machine with E10 in the tank. It likes to separate when nobody's looking!
 
I have not seen very much ethonal at the fuel stations around my town, I know it is not mandated. I have heard other horror story's when ethonal is used in boats, it will rot figerglass fuel tanks which are usually built into the hull, thus creating a disasterous situation. I use 87 octane in my suburban and 91 to 93 in our boat and snowmobiles. The boat has a 496, 425 hp I have not had any knock timing retard with using the premium fuel. It just isn't worth worrying over for the minmal cost.
 
A K MtnViper said:
There is no such thing as a free lunch. I.E. less pollutants means less HP, less MPG, don't kid yourself. Ethanol or the E85 is just a feel good fix, not a solution. Hybrid autos create so much pollution while being built that they will never make up for it in their lifetime. The only real solution is going back to horse and buggies as soon as we figure out how to stop horses from farting. Ranting is fun though and does not pollute much..
Click to expand...


I completely agree 100%. This is all true.

Alternative power systems like Hydrogen have the most potential, but are decades away from even being close to mainstream..... And you will always have the issue with hydrogen that a minor accident could cause an explosion that could flatten a city block.

I like AK MtnViper's comments!



:2strokes: ;)! :die: :hide: :Moon:
 
crapinal is a big problem! for one it absorbs two much water which it attracks,oil and water dont mix,oil is the life blood of a two stroke,crapinal is also a solvent which starts to break down the oil ,and in older sleds there are deposits in there fuel system ,tank,carbs,lines,fuelpump,from normal fuel it loosens those deposits and plugs jets and needles while your rideing ,once you totally clean with a good solvent and replace those parts you will eliminant that problem but as for the water problem there is no fix, water seperators are not a fix if water is there fuel is junk you will burn up your motor the only thing you can do is make sure you use up all your fuel dont leave anything sit with crapinal in the tank it degrades and seperates to fast put a fuel valve in line so you can run fuel out of carbs which will also give a little more oil to motor to help protect against oxidation on internals while it sits dont drive sled and then pull in heated storage that only helps the crapinal get more water, a vent valve would help to along with fuel valve for off time just had a customer whose fuel went bad in a weekend fresh on fri bad on mon, probably came from station almost saturated, was phaze seperated on mon you cannot see phaze seperation looking down in tank very easy
 
no1chevyboy said:
crapinal is a big problem! for one it absorbs two much water which it attracks,oil and water dont mix,oil is the life blood of a two stroke,crapinal is also a solvent which starts to break down the oil ,and in older sleds there are deposits in there fuel system ,tank,carbs,lines,fuelpump,from normal fuel it loosens those deposits and plugs jets and needles while your rideing ,once you totally clean with a good solvent and replace those parts you will eliminant that problem but as for the water problem there is no fix, water seperators are not a fix if water is there fuel is junk you will burn up your motor the only thing you can do is make sure you use up all your fuel dont leave anything sit with crapinal in the tank it degrades and seperates to fast put a fuel valve in line so you can run fuel out of carbs which will also give a little more oil to motor to help protect against oxidation on internals while it sits dont drive sled and then pull in heated storage that only helps the crapinal get more water, a vent valve would help to along with fuel valve for off time just had a customer whose fuel went bad in a weekend fresh on fri bad on mon, probably came from station almost saturated, was phaze seperated on mon you cannot see phaze seperation looking down in tank very easy
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X2!!!!!!!!!

Ethanol kills small 2 stroke engines. It's maybe OK for your larger 4 strokes that have EFI, but I would never use any oxygenated gas (ethanol) in any 2 strokes or carbed motors.....
 
just remember some liberial nut job that has no clue of the real world application has tested this in a controled enviroment and all is good, kind of like an engineer looks good on paper but doesnt work in real world LLLOOOOOOOLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!! just a little rant
 
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