So I feel retarded asking this, but, is there supposed to be ~1/2" of side to side play in your drive shaft? I noticed initially when I wash changing the oil in my chain case, the center bolt that goes through the cover and into the end of the shaft was gone and the hole in the case welded over. There is a new bolt inside the case, and the bottom sprocket, and whole shaft, moves side to side.
tofastSRX
New member
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO change the bearing
There is never a bolt that goes thru the outer cover into either the top[jackshaft] or the bottom[drive] shafts on a non reverse chaincase. On the reverse chain cases only there is a 10mm bolt that secures the idler shaft.
Sounds to me like[in a previous life] the lower bolt that secures the big chain sprocket to the drive shaft, backed out and wore thru the chaincase cover and someone welded the hole over.
When the drive shaft is installed properly the bottom gear bolt, when tight, secures the drive shaft in its position, pulled up tight in the chaincase bearing. After the bolt is tight, you then tighten the bearing lock collar set screws on the speedo drive side. When everything is installed properly the track drives should now be centred in the tunnel with NO SIDE TO SIDE MOVEMENT AT ALL!
If the track drives are not centred there is a problem.[measure from their centre or edge to the inside edge of the tunnel... the measurement should be the same or very close on each side.
JM.02c
Sounds to me like[in a previous life] the lower bolt that secures the big chain sprocket to the drive shaft, backed out and wore thru the chaincase cover and someone welded the hole over.
When the drive shaft is installed properly the bottom gear bolt, when tight, secures the drive shaft in its position, pulled up tight in the chaincase bearing. After the bolt is tight, you then tighten the bearing lock collar set screws on the speedo drive side. When everything is installed properly the track drives should now be centred in the tunnel with NO SIDE TO SIDE MOVEMENT AT ALL!
If the track drives are not centred there is a problem.[measure from their centre or edge to the inside edge of the tunnel... the measurement should be the same or very close on each side.
JM.02c
IMO:
As an update to my previous post.
That chaincase sounds like its lived a tough life, I think it would be prudent to remove the whole chaincase and check for damage to the bearing mount areas...the large snap ring that holds in the bottom bearing may be missing or the surface where it recesses into the case may be damaged allowing the bottom chaincase bearing to "float' in the case which would allow the drive shaft side play.
If it were mine...I think its time for a complete chaincase inspection and all new bearings + seals, top and bottom and speedo side bearing as well.
JM.02c
As an update to my previous post.
That chaincase sounds like its lived a tough life, I think it would be prudent to remove the whole chaincase and check for damage to the bearing mount areas...the large snap ring that holds in the bottom bearing may be missing or the surface where it recesses into the case may be damaged allowing the bottom chaincase bearing to "float' in the case which would allow the drive shaft side play.
If it were mine...I think its time for a complete chaincase inspection and all new bearings + seals, top and bottom and speedo side bearing as well.
JM.02c
Okay, so I had a few part names mixed up there, though I think you knew what I was talking about.
Anyway the play is in the jackshaft, not the drive shaft (i looked at the microfiche for a while and got everything straight). You can see from these pictures that I have attched (space b/w the lock collar and the tunnel), the shaft is not loose in any other way then sliding from one side of the sled to to the other (length ways of the shaft). So it would seem to be that the bearing is alright and I just need to adjust the lock collar tight, right? I'll replace the bearing if necessary, I just don't want to dump 65$ if this one is okay.
Next I measured from the center of my drivers, they are closest to even when I have the jackshaft pushed all the way to the clutch side (4 1/8" on the clutch side and 3 3/4" on the chaincase side). If I was to tightened up the lock collar and eliminate play, the shaft would be locked the opposite way giving me 4 1/2 on the clutch side and 3 3/8 on the chaincase side. Maybe this would explain why the jackshaft was not set properly. Now what, can i move the drivers if need be? This sled is becoming a lot more expensive and a time pig every day.
The guy I bought it from (2 months ago) said he had changed the jack shaft bearing, and mentioned something about the drivers, he also added a 136 to it. Did I get played or what, things don't seem to be as they should. Also, I am repairing my rear skid right now cause it is pooched. I might need to give him a call.
Also when I had the chain case apart i did not look at the bearing mounts, though there was no play other than the sliding in and out of the bearing (I could not move the lower sprocket up or down), so these mounts should be okay...well atleast they aren't giving me any play.
Thanks so much for your help! I've been riding sleds for quite a while, though this is the first time ever doing my own maintenance (maybe I shouldn't have bought a yammie, haha).
Anyway the play is in the jackshaft, not the drive shaft (i looked at the microfiche for a while and got everything straight). You can see from these pictures that I have attched (space b/w the lock collar and the tunnel), the shaft is not loose in any other way then sliding from one side of the sled to to the other (length ways of the shaft). So it would seem to be that the bearing is alright and I just need to adjust the lock collar tight, right? I'll replace the bearing if necessary, I just don't want to dump 65$ if this one is okay.
Next I measured from the center of my drivers, they are closest to even when I have the jackshaft pushed all the way to the clutch side (4 1/8" on the clutch side and 3 3/4" on the chaincase side). If I was to tightened up the lock collar and eliminate play, the shaft would be locked the opposite way giving me 4 1/2 on the clutch side and 3 3/8 on the chaincase side. Maybe this would explain why the jackshaft was not set properly. Now what, can i move the drivers if need be? This sled is becoming a lot more expensive and a time pig every day.
The guy I bought it from (2 months ago) said he had changed the jack shaft bearing, and mentioned something about the drivers, he also added a 136 to it. Did I get played or what, things don't seem to be as they should. Also, I am repairing my rear skid right now cause it is pooched. I might need to give him a call.
Also when I had the chain case apart i did not look at the bearing mounts, though there was no play other than the sliding in and out of the bearing (I could not move the lower sprocket up or down), so these mounts should be okay...well atleast they aren't giving me any play.
Thanks so much for your help! I've been riding sleds for quite a while, though this is the first time ever doing my own maintenance (maybe I shouldn't have bought a yammie, haha).
Attachments
You had the terminology right the first time...you are showing pictures of the"DRIVE SHAFT" thats the shaft the track drives are on. The Jackshaft is the shaft the secondary clutch attaches to...there should be no side to side movement of either shaft.
For the drive shaft to move side to side means a few things:
-the spacer that goes behind the lower[big]gear in the chaincase is missing
-the bolt that holds the lower chain gear in place is loose
-the chaincase lower bearing is broken +/or moving in and out of its mounting recess in the chaincase[it is normally held in place from the inside of the case with a big snap ring]
-the opposite side of the drive shaft[speedo drive side] bearing collar is loose.
You could have all or some of these issues.
You also have "extrovert" drivers on this sled...they are not a stock driver which means someone has changed these and maybe they did not get them centred properly, those measurements are not right, they should be exactly the same maybe within 1/4" and even that is pushing it!
I would think the drive shaft is not centering properly when tightened due to the above mentioned possible issues, but you never know, they may have had to leave the gear spacer out so the drive shaft would centre some what because of improper driver installation...
LOL!
anything is possible
For the drive shaft to move side to side means a few things:
-the spacer that goes behind the lower[big]gear in the chaincase is missing
-the bolt that holds the lower chain gear in place is loose
-the chaincase lower bearing is broken +/or moving in and out of its mounting recess in the chaincase[it is normally held in place from the inside of the case with a big snap ring]
-the opposite side of the drive shaft[speedo drive side] bearing collar is loose.
You could have all or some of these issues.
You also have "extrovert" drivers on this sled...they are not a stock driver which means someone has changed these and maybe they did not get them centred properly, those measurements are not right, they should be exactly the same maybe within 1/4" and even that is pushing it!
I would think the drive shaft is not centering properly when tightened due to the above mentioned possible issues, but you never know, they may have had to leave the gear spacer out so the drive shaft would centre some what because of improper driver installation...
LOL!
anything is possible
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I have extroverts on all my Yamahas.
Here is the measurements taken from my SRX spare shaft with the extroverts installed[this is from my 8 tooth driver shaft that was on the sled so it is a known proper installation, I am currently running 9 tooth extroverts]:
-set the complete driveshaft [with the extrovert drivers installed]on a flat surface[floor]
-butt the chaincase side end of the shaft against a vertical surface[wall]
-measure from the wall to the centre of the closest driver...mine = 18cm[7 1/8"]
-then measure to centre of second driver...mine = 41cm[16 1/8"]
I run the spread of the drivers centre to centre of the extrovert drivers at 22.8cm[9"], my Ripsaw track window centres are 22.5cm[8 7/8 "] apart
With all your bearings properly installed + with the proper gear spacers in place, the above measurements should centre you drivers in the tunnel as it does on mine.
Hope this helps
Here is the measurements taken from my SRX spare shaft with the extroverts installed[this is from my 8 tooth driver shaft that was on the sled so it is a known proper installation, I am currently running 9 tooth extroverts]:
-set the complete driveshaft [with the extrovert drivers installed]on a flat surface[floor]
-butt the chaincase side end of the shaft against a vertical surface[wall]
-measure from the wall to the centre of the closest driver...mine = 18cm[7 1/8"]
-then measure to centre of second driver...mine = 41cm[16 1/8"]
I run the spread of the drivers centre to centre of the extrovert drivers at 22.8cm[9"], my Ripsaw track window centres are 22.5cm[8 7/8 "] apart
With all your bearings properly installed + with the proper gear spacers in place, the above measurements should centre you drivers in the tunnel as it does on mine.
Hope this helps
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slideshow - I don't want to be a thread hog here so could you PM me and tell me what the benefits of extrovert drivers are vs stock? If you think it is improtant enough may be post it in this thread.
Mills said:
I started running extroverts when they first came out for a couple of reasons[I was still competing in Sno drags at the time]:
-you can elliminate the outer involute drives which saves some rotating mass
-you can run the tracks much looser before they ratchet[less rolling resistance to a point]
There are a couple negative issues I found using extroverts on the Yamaha SX + SRX chassis:
-you need to run a fully windowed track...most times fully clipped = more rotating mass!
-On the SX + SRXs, the 9 tooth extroverts tips will actually hit the front suspension "W" arm crossshaft, so they need to be trimmed a bit. Once they are trimmed you lose a lot of the ability to loosen the track as they will now ratchet!
-the 9 tooth driver teeth can interfere with the slide rail tips[I never had this issue]
-to avoid interferance with the cross shaft and ratcheting issues, 8 tooth extroverts work, but then you lose efficiency!
-I never noticed any performance improvements by installing them on my SX + SRXs but they did work very well on my 800VMAX4 Mod with 8 tooth + a 1.6" track
I would recommend that, if you need to change to 8 tooth drivers for track clearance[1.5" and up], make sure you get a full clip track and by all means install the 8 tooth extroverts as you will see all their advantages + none of their disadvantages. I still like and use them as 9 tooth but in most cases they are just an excess...LOL! but thats the way I roll!
Every application and use is different so I guess you have to draw your own conclusions.
JM.02c
Bob
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valin
Active member
sideshowBob said:
You don't have to go with extroverts to eliminate the outer drivers. I only run two drivers on all of my sleds. Running 4 drivers is just a pain in the azz when changing tracks.
valin said:
I never tried that, but it would also definately be the lighter of the two, as the extroverts are heavier then the regular drives on a one on one basis.
Vmax540
VIP Member
Are you possibly saying the jackshaft rotates/turns 1/2" if, so that would be the slack in the chain which, would be about right.
Thanks for the expertise slideshow, Ya it sounds like I'm missing the spacer, possibly the snap ring too. I'll check it out, as well as the bearing. Either way I'll have to move the drivers to the correct position (thanks for the measurements). Is there a set screw, or how do I move them? I'm running a 1 3/4 track so that would explain the 8 tooth extroverts, why the previous guy didn't install them correctly I don't know.
Vmax- nope, it's not that movement , chain tension is fine.
Vmax- nope, it's not that movement , chain tension is fine.