tyler440
Member
Alright guys, after owning my 01 srx for 2 years now i finally decided i should figure out why i am not getting the rpm i should.
what can you guys tell me about the clutch parts i have?
most importantly, how do i put the secondary back together. like a moron i just ripped it apart and totally forgot to even record where it was set! Im pretty sure it was in hole 1 on the sheave, and 9 (90*?) on the helix. but what are the actual steps with this roller stuff? i dont understand how far i should twist the helix.
my riding consists of blasting from field to field mostly... so im looking to get the most out of the first 1000' in generally loose snow
im not sure what the heelclickers even weigh, ill get them weighed as soon as i get a scale.
since im am down on rpm, i think i need less tip weight, but im not even sure how good or bad the parts i have are for performance.
what can you guys tell me about the clutch parts i have?
most importantly, how do i put the secondary back together. like a moron i just ripped it apart and totally forgot to even record where it was set! Im pretty sure it was in hole 1 on the sheave, and 9 (90*?) on the helix. but what are the actual steps with this roller stuff? i dont understand how far i should twist the helix.
my riding consists of blasting from field to field mostly... so im looking to get the most out of the first 1000' in generally loose snow
im not sure what the heelclickers even weigh, ill get them weighed as soon as i get a scale.
since im am down on rpm, i think i need less tip weight, but im not even sure how good or bad the parts i have are for performance.
youd have to list what bolt and how many washers are on each hole in the weight, red or grey primary spring, what helix your using and what color sec spring your using........crystal ball is a little foggy tonight, cant see what you have.............
tyler440
Member
tyler440
Member
sorry the pictures didnt attach the first time because they were too big and i figured i would have at least a 5min grace period before someone actually saw my post hahaha... turns out maybe lots of people are getting ready for the season
tyler440
Member
both primary and secondary springs are red
hey, the crystal ball is gettin more clear...lol. Pics are good!
first off right off the bat the reason your low on rpm is the helix, coupled with a roller sec is the problem, its got way too steep of a finish angle and add a roller sec. youll need some massive rear spring pressure to control the upshift, thus its slowing you down, the low rpm is from the finish angle of the helix being too steep.
looking at your weights you have the older weights with the nutserts, so I am unsure of your exact weight without verifying them on a gram scale.
before we get too deep, do you have any other helixs to use on the sled?
first off right off the bat the reason your low on rpm is the helix, coupled with a roller sec is the problem, its got way too steep of a finish angle and add a roller sec. youll need some massive rear spring pressure to control the upshift, thus its slowing you down, the low rpm is from the finish angle of the helix being too steep.
looking at your weights you have the older weights with the nutserts, so I am unsure of your exact weight without verifying them on a gram scale.
before we get too deep, do you have any other helixs to use on the sled?
YAMMIEGOD3:16
Active member
tyler, you have some pretty good stuff there. a hauck magnum roller secondary ? bender 2070 is a 47-43 angles. wrong helix.
tyler440
Member
no i dont have any other helixs to try, i really dont have any other parts for these clutches.
one of the primary weights as a little more play in the bushings than i would like to see and 2 of them have some very slight pitting on then. should i buy the new style of weights or are mine still ok to work with?
The pitting truely doesnt concern me so if i can just get 3 new bushings and run the old "nutserts"/ profile i will. im just thinking if they are too much different than everyone elses i should probably get on the same page. then again maybe i wont even be able to find bushings and different weight for the old stuff?
i sorta thought they were an older style because i havent seen anything quite like them, hence the pictures.
as far as the roller secondary goes, it seems like an OEM clutch with the hauck machine/bolt on roller parts. these dont seem to popular either, but it has to be better than stock. Right?
so should i go with your typically recommended setup for the helix tony? anyone know where i can find one for a good price?
hell i just realized, maybe i should tear into the chaincase and make sure they last guy didnt mess with the gears.
the funny thing is, he told me not to even think about touching the clutching because it was spot on haha... Really? then why isnt it revving out like it should? haha I hate not knowing much and being smarter than someone else
one of the primary weights as a little more play in the bushings than i would like to see and 2 of them have some very slight pitting on then. should i buy the new style of weights or are mine still ok to work with?
The pitting truely doesnt concern me so if i can just get 3 new bushings and run the old "nutserts"/ profile i will. im just thinking if they are too much different than everyone elses i should probably get on the same page. then again maybe i wont even be able to find bushings and different weight for the old stuff?
i sorta thought they were an older style because i havent seen anything quite like them, hence the pictures.
as far as the roller secondary goes, it seems like an OEM clutch with the hauck machine/bolt on roller parts. these dont seem to popular either, but it has to be better than stock. Right?
so should i go with your typically recommended setup for the helix tony? anyone know where i can find one for a good price?
hell i just realized, maybe i should tear into the chaincase and make sure they last guy didnt mess with the gears.
the funny thing is, he told me not to even think about touching the clutching because it was spot on haha... Really? then why isnt it revving out like it should? haha I hate not knowing much and being smarter than someone else
you can still use the weights, they are just the older style with the nutserts, the profile of the shift is basicly the same its just the way the hardware is held to the weight. The weight of them is slightly differnt because of the hardware and also the reason your clutch had to be notched on the sheave to clear the heel hardware. the bushings can be replaced by simply putting in new ones,like any other clutch weight. Super torq. likely has them in stock. The newer weight is just threaded in the body and the heel part was redesigned to clear the sheave without notching the sheave, thats all.
For the rear clutch thats just a "add on" roller to the stock yamaha sec clutch, and they worked good for on the gas and off the gas type trail riding, its a improved backshift with faster upshift as well. Youll need more rear spring tension to hang onto the belt without overshifting because of the decreased roller resistance on the helix ramp. So in other words yes, its better then stock if thats the type of riding you do. Hauck used his this way so you could use the stock yamaha helix types in it yet, most others used a differnt style helix.
As for the helix, thats where I would suggest you spend any $$ as thats the main culprit or wrong part in your combo. The helix you have was originally off a 2000 srx700 kit, its angles are 49/47 when I checked one. Its way too steep on the finish angle to use with heel clickers and thats why its low on topend rpm. They were trying to band aid the problem by winding the sec. spring up at 100 degrees to combat the angle and the roller clutch wanting to backshift from the lack of torq.
Get a helix somewhere in the area of a 48/36 and it will be alot more responsive. Youll need slightly smaller then normal angles as the roller will make the helix shift like a bigger angle due to the decreased friction. Youll then only need to run the rear spring twist around 80 and it will improve everything about the set up. Most of the time youll need a slver dot yamaha sec spring in a roller secondary, green dot can be used but usually at a higher twist as its a weaker spring.
I am not sure of your rear spring maybe a pic of that would help, hopefully its not a hauck red snocross spring.
Before I did anything, I would remove one of the weights and weigh each spots hardware, Heel, mid and tip on a gram scale.
For the rear clutch thats just a "add on" roller to the stock yamaha sec clutch, and they worked good for on the gas and off the gas type trail riding, its a improved backshift with faster upshift as well. Youll need more rear spring tension to hang onto the belt without overshifting because of the decreased roller resistance on the helix ramp. So in other words yes, its better then stock if thats the type of riding you do. Hauck used his this way so you could use the stock yamaha helix types in it yet, most others used a differnt style helix.
As for the helix, thats where I would suggest you spend any $$ as thats the main culprit or wrong part in your combo. The helix you have was originally off a 2000 srx700 kit, its angles are 49/47 when I checked one. Its way too steep on the finish angle to use with heel clickers and thats why its low on topend rpm. They were trying to band aid the problem by winding the sec. spring up at 100 degrees to combat the angle and the roller clutch wanting to backshift from the lack of torq.
Get a helix somewhere in the area of a 48/36 and it will be alot more responsive. Youll need slightly smaller then normal angles as the roller will make the helix shift like a bigger angle due to the decreased friction. Youll then only need to run the rear spring twist around 80 and it will improve everything about the set up. Most of the time youll need a slver dot yamaha sec spring in a roller secondary, green dot can be used but usually at a higher twist as its a weaker spring.
I am not sure of your rear spring maybe a pic of that would help, hopefully its not a hauck red snocross spring.
Before I did anything, I would remove one of the weights and weigh each spots hardware, Heel, mid and tip on a gram scale.
tyler440
Member
10-4... i will get the weights measured soon... also ill look into that secondary spring and get a picture of it. its good to know i can just replace the bushings in the weights, i have SOME money to play with but i dont want to have to buy everything all over again haha. i assume different "hardware" for the weights will be available at the same place as the bushings.
like i said, ill get those weighed asap, in the meantime if anyone knows where i can find a good used helix that would be awesome
like i said, ill get those weighed asap, in the meantime if anyone knows where i can find a good used helix that would be awesome
YAMMIEGOD3:16
Active member
Tyler If It Was Me And Only Me Talking Here, I Would Shelf That Whole Secondary And Find A Good Stock One Here. Dime A Dozen. I Am Pretty Bone Head On Yamaha Stuff, Sorry that stuff Works. that 2070 is listed at a 47-43 on benders helix list i have, look how inaccurate that info is. 48-36 , 50 -37 would work way better with your set-up. 3:16 (yammie Tony)
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tyler440
Member
oh guys here are some more pictures
im not positive exactly what you guys are measuring so you can see for your self what i measured
EDIT: (btw i think with the old forum it showed the file name and made these pictures more clear, now you have to roll your mouse over them to display the filename and understand what the picture is)
moral of the story:
heel-5grams (bolt+ 6 washers)
center-5grams (nutsert + 2 steel washers)
tip- 4grams (nutsert + 1 steel washer)
Also a couple pictures of my springs
im not positive exactly what you guys are measuring so you can see for your self what i measured
EDIT: (btw i think with the old forum it showed the file name and made these pictures more clear, now you have to roll your mouse over them to display the filename and understand what the picture is)
moral of the story:
heel-5grams (bolt+ 6 washers)
center-5grams (nutsert + 2 steel washers)
tip- 4grams (nutsert + 1 steel washer)
Also a couple pictures of my springs
Attachments
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great, now we know what you have(good job on the pics and relaying the information). It will just depend on what you want to do from here out and what your willing to replace to get a good working combo.
Option 1:std rear button clutch,differnt helix and sec spring,differnt weight set up..
The rear roller clutch will require a smaller helix then if you use a standard button clutch. Having said that, the helix Tony suggested will work great in a standard button clutch, lots of times I go right to a 50/36 in a srx with heel clickers. Works well with 4-5 grams in the heel, empty middle and 6 grams in the tip. Red primary spring. 50/36,50/37,51/37 rear helix with green yamaha sec spring at 70-80 twist.
Option 2: keep roller sec clutch, differnt sec spring and helix,differnt weight set up...
Keeping the rear roller clutch youll need something smaller like a 48/36 helix, even helixs with 45-47 start with a 34-36 finish will work well. I would use a silver yamaha sec spring as the one you have there is a hauck red snocross spring, I have never liked them for anything in my own opinion and trying to use one before I would say it will be especially bad with a roller sec. I would use the same 4-5 grams in the heel, empty middle hole and 6 grams tip, 48/36 or close helix with a silver dot sec spring at 80 twist in the clutch.
not running weight in the middle hole will make the engine more free revving and a little more fun to ride/play with. When you put weight in both holes it slows down the engines response. You CAN run weight in both holes but I would lighten them up if you choose to do so. The profile of the weight is aggressive and the heel is what gives them the big edge so the amount of weight you use just needs to be appropiate for the clamping of the belt thru the shift curve.
BTW-theres quite a few std rear button clutchs for sale for around $30 in the classifieds if you choose to go that way.
Option 1:std rear button clutch,differnt helix and sec spring,differnt weight set up..
The rear roller clutch will require a smaller helix then if you use a standard button clutch. Having said that, the helix Tony suggested will work great in a standard button clutch, lots of times I go right to a 50/36 in a srx with heel clickers. Works well with 4-5 grams in the heel, empty middle and 6 grams in the tip. Red primary spring. 50/36,50/37,51/37 rear helix with green yamaha sec spring at 70-80 twist.
Option 2: keep roller sec clutch, differnt sec spring and helix,differnt weight set up...
Keeping the rear roller clutch youll need something smaller like a 48/36 helix, even helixs with 45-47 start with a 34-36 finish will work well. I would use a silver yamaha sec spring as the one you have there is a hauck red snocross spring, I have never liked them for anything in my own opinion and trying to use one before I would say it will be especially bad with a roller sec. I would use the same 4-5 grams in the heel, empty middle hole and 6 grams tip, 48/36 or close helix with a silver dot sec spring at 80 twist in the clutch.
not running weight in the middle hole will make the engine more free revving and a little more fun to ride/play with. When you put weight in both holes it slows down the engines response. You CAN run weight in both holes but I would lighten them up if you choose to do so. The profile of the weight is aggressive and the heel is what gives them the big edge so the amount of weight you use just needs to be appropiate for the clamping of the belt thru the shift curve.
BTW-theres quite a few std rear button clutchs for sale for around $30 in the classifieds if you choose to go that way.
YAMMIEGOD3:16
Active member
don, love option one. tyler, thats a hot -setup. now i never used a roller and if you decide to keep yours option 2 is the way to go. their are two things on the srx yamaha hit a home run with. stock pipes and the stock secondary. 3:16 (yammie tony)
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tyler440
Member
seems like it would be more cost effective to keep the clutch i have now and just buy a new spring and helix. As opposed to buying a new clutch, and spring and helix?
That all depends on which helix i find for a good price, or if i have to man up and buy one new.
I suppose more people are running button clutches tho and there would be more input on them. Are you running buttons mrviper?
That all depends on which helix i find for a good price, or if i have to man up and buy one new.
I suppose more people are running button clutches tho and there would be more input on them. Are you running buttons mrviper?
tyler440
Member
anyone interested in the parts i have (hauck roller setup, hauck snowcross spring, and 47/43 helix)
i guess my primary stuff can be reworked with what i have. (take a washer from the center and put it on the tip, take everything else out of the center, maybe a washer or 2 off the heel)
WHEN IS IT GOING TO START SNOWING?!?!?!
i guess my primary stuff can be reworked with what i have. (take a washer from the center and put it on the tip, take everything else out of the center, maybe a washer or 2 off the heel)
WHEN IS IT GOING TO START SNOWING?!?!?!
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tyler440
Member
how about my roller clutch and a dalton 46/34 helix with the silver spring?
reason i ask is, i think that helix is for sale in the classifieds... or should i keep looking?
also on the silver spring, is it all silver, or just a silver dot?
reason i ask is, i think that helix is for sale in the classifieds... or should i keep looking?
also on the silver spring, is it all silver, or just a silver dot?
what did you decide to do?
forgot about this post, was going thru some back pages and saw i never responded back, sorry... get busy and forget at times.
forgot about this post, was going thru some back pages and saw i never responded back, sorry... get busy and forget at times.
tyler440
Member
i just got back to it myself, tonight i am going to move some weight from the center to the tip and see if i can get the extra rpm i should have... then ill go from there
ok, but nothing is gonna get real good till you get rid of the 47 degree finish angle on that helix, you need a shallower finish angle.
the secondary springs from yamaha are all black and just have a color dot on them,green,silver,etc.
the secondary springs from yamaha are all black and just have a color dot on them,green,silver,etc.