Checking belt align and deflection how to?

mrviper700 said:
it wont matter if the primary is off a vmax4 or not still work the same, the difference will be on the roller axles the early ones were 8mm instead of 9mm, so its just the rollers that will be different, wont effect the way the clutch operates. The 89a10 weights are from a 93-94 vmax4, the 1992 weights only had 1 hole in them and were 89a-00, not 89a-10. anyways, just need to see the rollers, and a pic of the rivets in the weights, which I see were gold colored and short so likely are either 2.4 or 2.7 grams.

you need to have like 15-15.5mm rollers, put the g/w/g spring back in with the 89a10 weights, then set up the rear clutch with your helix and the red dot spring set at 70 degrees twist(6 on the helix and 1 inside the clutch), twist the helix till it lines up with first set of pads and stud holes, bolt it down and then report back rpm. Cant tune the sled till you know what it does rpm wise.
Click to expand...

Ok so here goes. I put the gwg spring back in the primary. Left my brand new red in the secondary wrapped at 70. Brand new 8dn belt. Sits a tad high in the secondary at 2.5mm ish. out on the lake I hit it from a 50kmh/5000rpm ish roll and it pulled hard and the rpm went all the way to 8500, and I let off due to not knowing the track I was on in the pitch black dark. We went over to another lake where's there's a trail on it. Wide lane and hard packed. Went across slow scoping the scene and then u turned. Took off from almost a dead stop, and the rpm did not climb to 8500 but the sled pulled pretty hard, only went up to about 7800ish, I missed the shift down rpm but sad to say only went 78mph. Clutches were not hot after the pull, although it is -37c right now lol.
Crossed the other lake again and hit it from a 40kmh roll and boom 8500 rpm, let off due to a powder spot.
Seems as if it really likes the roll race but not from a dead stop. I have to do more evaluating tomorrow in the daylight so I can pay more attention to the shift rpm, and so that I can really compare the roll race to the dig race.
All in all I'm getting somewhere cause my belt is riding way higher in the sheave than it was and I can actually hit peak rpm. Before the highest I saw was 7800ish even from a roll and the accel was way more delayed. Now it pulls like an ape just need to get the back half of the run figured out so I can get up to and past 100 mph hopefully. I'll post the pics for you in a minute
 
image.jpg

Having some trouble posting more pics. These are the only ones I can upload. The rivets are a gold color, and they are short yes, they are flush basically with the edges of the weight, they don't stick out past either side. As for rollers....
.580"-.590" ish. So 14.9ish mm, I guess that's considered a 15.0mm od roller?
 
View attachment 60627

Having some trouble posting more pics. These are the only ones I can upload. The rivets are a gold color, and they are short yes, they are flush basically with the edges of the weight, they don't stick out past either side. As for rollers....
.580"-.590" ish. So 14.9ish mm, I guess that's considered a 15.0mm od roller?
 
Ok pics posted, sorry for the doubles and multiple posts. Up north here only 1 bar signal on my cell and I think all the cell phone signals may be frozen stiff in mid air lol. Cold as a mutha up here. -37c.
 
You have 2.4 gram rivet with 15mm roller. Looks like to me the shaft were the clutch slides back & forth is scored. just checked my clutch and it is smooth.
 
good eye fastsrx, I saw the same thing on the center shaft.

as he said the center shaft is scored on the clutch, since its apart grab the moveable sheave and see how easy it slides up and down on the spider shaft, if it drags as it looks you may need to use some fine grit emery paper and wrap a piece about 6 inchs long and hold each end, sand the center down till its smooth and the sheave slides up and down with no drag. If its bad, it will need the bushing replaced in the moveable sheave.
 
It's not as it looks. A bit dirty/greasy but not scored. It slides pretty easy but I will double check again.
Are we now certain that I have 2.4 gram rivets in my weights?
I did a good run today with the sled. Put on 135kms with my buddy and my dad. Again today managed to pull 8500 easily a couple times, it shifts down to 7000ish and will pull up to 7500 and then bam! Brick wall is hit. Still stuck at 80mph. :(
How do I remedy this. Don't know enough about the clutches yet. Do I need a stronger primary spring? More gram weight? Stronger secondary spring? Tighter wrap? Don't really know the affects of these parts, I only have assumptions on what they will do....I assume normal good operation would pull up to peak rpm, shift down and then pull up to peak again and stay there? If this is correct can 1000rpm really cause me to be down 30+mph?
Once again it's 89A-10 weights, gwg primary spring, stock srx helix, red spring wrapped at 70. Belt height is 2-2.5mm and it's a new 8dn belt
 
stock 47 degree helix is too steep for use with everything else you have, with those 89a10 weights you need a rear helix about a 48-50 start with a lower finish angle around 40-42 degrees, that will change everything about it and make it a lot more fun to ride. Personally I would throw in a 48/42 if it were my sled and run your red sec spring at 60-70 degrees, that will make it work a lot better.
You will likely over rev some on top but you still have 2 different options to remedy that and dial it in. Either add different rivets and add weight or simply swap to your yellow/white/yellow spring which would bring down the rpm and allow for a slightly quicker upshift, lowering rpm but still shifting quickly making the sled accelerate faster. You kinda want to lug the engine at the beginning and let it climb to 8400rpm, it will go much faster this way. When you first smash the gas your looking for 8000-8100rpm, then it should climb kinda slow to 8400rpm on topend.
 
mrviper700 said:
stock 47 degree helix is too steep for use with everything else you have, with those 89a10 weights you need a rear helix about a 48-50 start with a lower finish angle around 40-42 degrees, that will change everything about it and make it a lot more fun to ride. Personally I would throw in a 48/42 if it were my sled and run your red sec spring at 60-70 degrees, that will make it work a lot better.
You will likely over rev some on top but you still have 2 different options to remedy that and dial it in. Either add different rivets and add weight or simply swap to your yellow/white/yellow spring which would bring down the rpm and allow for a slightly quicker upshift, lowering rpm but still shifting quickly making the sled accelerate faster. You kinda want to lug the engine at the beginning and let it climb to 8400rpm, it will go much faster this way. When you first smash the gas your looking for 8000-8100rpm, then it should climb kinda slow to 8400rpm on topend.
Click to expand...

Ok. All that explains a couple things much better. Thanks!
After riding again today I noticed that the sled does in fact hit 8000-8100 most times at the first stab of the throttle when hitting it from a roll. It shifts to around 7k and will climb to 7500 and not anymore. When I stab the throttle off a holeshot the sled revs to 7500-7700ish and just doesn't want to go. It accelerates like garbage. There is no shift and you basically abort the run.
Couple questions for you and thoughts from me, to try and help me grasp everything a bit better.
Stiffer primary spring=more rpm?
More weight will fight primary spring and lower rpm?
So tuning of the primary sometimes can not be ideal with a spring swap so for that fine adjustment you would just add or remove weight depending on what you need to do?
Im totally lost on the function and characteristics of a helix.

Lastly, should I not just put a stock 99 srx primary setup on and call it a day? I'm assuming yammy sets there stuff up for all purpose to an extent. And srx's do go 115-120mph in ideal conditions bone stock do they not?
I'm seeing some fine cracks starting on my primary sheaves(I think that's what they are at least), and want to replace the primary because of it. I could keep the 89a10 weights and rollers etc.

I know people say drag race setups like the 8bu 00 are not ideal for trail due to back shifting is no good. What is meant by this.

Honestly I just want to go fast lol! Most trails I ride you can't go like a snocross racer anyways. It's an average of 40-50 km/h speed. Rough terrain.
At one time you suggested a 50/44 helix, www primary, g secondary wrapped at 60-70. For trail riding with good recovery on and off the throttle and good hole shots.
What's the difference in characteristics between that and say a 89a10 setup or a 8bu00 setup?

Thanks again for all your patience
 
by changing the helix it will totally change how the sled runs as of now, it will backshift much better due to the shallower finish angle of the aftermarket helix( that's what your lacking with on and off the gas and it just makes noise and doesn't pull).

The 89a10 weights are much more aggressive then the stock 8dn10 are,thats why since you already have 3/4 of the good parts to get the helix to finish it and make it work better. You always have the option to buy a set of the 8dn10 weights and run it stock with the y/w/y spring you bought. Yamaha makes the stock clutching a compromise, they don't know if a 80yr old grandma is riding it or a 21 yr old kid so its made to run in the middle, not aggressive and not lazy.
 
mrviper700 said:
by changing the helix it will totally change how the sled runs as of now, it will backshift much better due to the shallower finish angle of the aftermarket helix( that's what your lacking with on and off the gas and it just makes noise and doesn't pull).

The 89a10 weights are much more aggressive then the stock 8dn10 are,thats why since you already have 3/4 of the good parts to get the helix to finish it and make it work better. You always have the option to buy a set of the 8dn10 weights and run it stock with the y/w/y spring you bought. Yamaha makes the stock clutching a compromise, they don't know if a 80yr old grandma is riding it or a 21 yr old kid so its made to run in the middle, not aggressive and not lazy.
Click to expand...

the sled is ok off and on the throttle through turns and such(trail), although it could be better I guess, especially when letting off down a hill and then throttling up the next hill, its a bit lazy. if I run the 48/42 helix you suggested this thing will be a decent trail sled and a beast on the lake or no? also will it perform properly on a hole shot. as I said before the thing is absolute garbage from a standstill, it seems that it just shifts right away and theres no pull at all. if I remember correctly you said to use a standard "y" series helix if going with Dalton correct? thank you sir
 
mrviper700 said:
stock 47 degree helix is too steep for use with everything else you have, with those 89a10 weights you need a rear helix about a 48-50 start with a lower finish angle around 40-42 degrees, that will change everything about it and make it a lot more fun to ride. Personally I would throw in a 48/42 if it were my sled and run your red sec spring at 60-70 degrees, that will make it work a lot better.
You will likely over rev some on top but you still have 2 different options to remedy that and dial it in. Either add different rivets and add weight or simply swap to your yellow/white/yellow spring which would bring down the rpm and allow for a slightly quicker upshift, lowering rpm but still shifting quickly making the sled accelerate faster. You kinda want to lug the engine at the beginning and let it climb to 8400rpm, it will go much faster this way. When you first smash the gas your looking for 8000-8100rpm, then it should climb kinda slow to 8400rpm on topend.
Click to expand...

I am waiting on some stock 8dn-10 weights from a buddy. Once I get them I will have a stock setup complete to play with.
Above you recommend a 48/42 helix with a gwg primary and Rex secondary. I was forwarded a link to a helix angle page on this site which stated a 8bvfa helix (51/43) off of an 03 rx actually performs like a 48/42. You think that helix would be OK to try out. I see a setup on Turks tuning page with the same parts but a different primary spring and a tad more rivet weight.
 
This is what mrviper700 recomended for my friends 98 8dn-20 out of a 2000-02 srx, use 4.5 rivets in both holes, use a w/w/w/ primary spring, stock 15.6mm rollers. get a 50-44, or 51-45 helix with a green dot sec. spring at 60-70 twist for the rear clutch, will really wake it up. The 8dn-10 are very close to the -20.
 
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