dstoehr
New member
I'm feelin' ya Yamirider and doktorC
L-O-N-G
Of course, anyone can argue against anything with validity, but the following comments are simply my way of trying to summarize Yamaha’s sleds:
Yep, Yammi's are more expensive than the others, and they very well should be.
Are BMW's more expensive than Chevrolet's? Yes. Do you know why? Is it because BMW's line-up appeals to the entire population? No. Is it because BMW's are always faster? Not particularly. Is it because BMW's are always lighter? No. (you see where I’m going here?)
It's because BMW's are built from higher quality materials and components; it's because they are engineered for smoothness and refinement; it's because they are balanced for maximum driving satisfaction; it's because they are designed and marketed as a premium vehicle for those people who are after a premium product; it's because tight guidelines are set for fit and finish, it’s because they do so many things well and are simply…better overall... which make them more expensive. (I know, I’m setting myself up to have darts thrown at me, but this is just my opinion, okay! Hear me out.)
BMW builds great cars for the market they are in, and is an extremely successful and profitable company. I doubt you will ever see them building low-end cars or plastic-clad entry-level compact pocket rockets or pick-up trucks (although they have two SUV's now. Sorry SAV's) and trying to beat out the competitors on price. That’s not what they do. Yamaha sleds are very similar in this respect, much like many of Yamaha’s other products. They don’t appeal to everybody, but they do appeal to the people Yamaha wants them to appeal to.
Back to BMW. Based on the reports of test drivers from all walks of car racing, from all over the planet, I'd find it hard to deny that the M3 is probably the best all-round sports car on the face of the earth. Is it the fastest sports car available? Does it pull the most G's in a corner? Does it have the biggest sunroof? No, no, no. You will always find some other car that can out-do each one of the M3's specs, but you will be very hard pressed to find a car that can out-do all of them. A Ferrari Enzo does the majority of things better than the M3, but it also costs ten times more!
I believe that the Apex GT or RTX will be a fine parallel for the M3. A $100,000 sled would hopefully do most everything better than any sled ever, but the Apex doesn't cost 10 times more than other sleds, it only costs a little bit more, and it will surely perform every task it was designed to do, and do them all very well. Quality? Yep. Smooth? Yep. Fast? Feature-packed? Reliable? Yep, yep, yep…… Bar none, I don’t think anybody from any camp can argue with Yamaha’s blend of the utmost levels of engineering, quality, refinement, reliability, technology and all-round performance that these sleds bring to the market.
If Yamaha simply wanted to beat everyone else out on price, they probably could. Yamaha Motor Corporation is so big (compared to the competitors), and sleds make up such a small part of their overall business that they could sell sleds at cost without seriously hurting their overall financial viability as a company. The point here is, the ‘little’ snowmobile group at Yamaha has it’s own goals, and profitability is the number one goal. Build a premium product for the right target that represents great value, and you will be able to charge a premium price for it. Unit volume is one thing, but profitability is where the fun begins!! The more profitable they are, the more they can innovate and develop and improve and push the limits of convention and design into the future. I believe that’s how Yamaha is thinking as we head into a new era in snowmobiles. Creep up the number of units sold while mainting these profits, and that's an obvious recipe for success.
Does this mean all Yamaha riders should want BMW's? Nope. It's all about what's important to you and your needs. People buy Kia’s for their own reasons, and other people buy Aston Martin’s for their reasons. I don't drive any of the cars I’ve mentioned (but man would I love a new Kia
), nor do I ride a new Yamaha sled either. I'm true blue through and through, but I simply can't justify the cost of any new high-end sled at this point in my life, no matter who manufactures it. With that said, the things that Yamaha brings to the table are important to me for my reasons, and if I had the coin, I’d already have a shiny new deposit receipt to stare at for the next 10 months. I'm taking donations 
L-O-N-G
Of course, anyone can argue against anything with validity, but the following comments are simply my way of trying to summarize Yamaha’s sleds:
Yep, Yammi's are more expensive than the others, and they very well should be.
Are BMW's more expensive than Chevrolet's? Yes. Do you know why? Is it because BMW's line-up appeals to the entire population? No. Is it because BMW's are always faster? Not particularly. Is it because BMW's are always lighter? No. (you see where I’m going here?)
It's because BMW's are built from higher quality materials and components; it's because they are engineered for smoothness and refinement; it's because they are balanced for maximum driving satisfaction; it's because they are designed and marketed as a premium vehicle for those people who are after a premium product; it's because tight guidelines are set for fit and finish, it’s because they do so many things well and are simply…better overall... which make them more expensive. (I know, I’m setting myself up to have darts thrown at me, but this is just my opinion, okay! Hear me out.)
BMW builds great cars for the market they are in, and is an extremely successful and profitable company. I doubt you will ever see them building low-end cars or plastic-clad entry-level compact pocket rockets or pick-up trucks (although they have two SUV's now. Sorry SAV's) and trying to beat out the competitors on price. That’s not what they do. Yamaha sleds are very similar in this respect, much like many of Yamaha’s other products. They don’t appeal to everybody, but they do appeal to the people Yamaha wants them to appeal to.
Back to BMW. Based on the reports of test drivers from all walks of car racing, from all over the planet, I'd find it hard to deny that the M3 is probably the best all-round sports car on the face of the earth. Is it the fastest sports car available? Does it pull the most G's in a corner? Does it have the biggest sunroof? No, no, no. You will always find some other car that can out-do each one of the M3's specs, but you will be very hard pressed to find a car that can out-do all of them. A Ferrari Enzo does the majority of things better than the M3, but it also costs ten times more!
I believe that the Apex GT or RTX will be a fine parallel for the M3. A $100,000 sled would hopefully do most everything better than any sled ever, but the Apex doesn't cost 10 times more than other sleds, it only costs a little bit more, and it will surely perform every task it was designed to do, and do them all very well. Quality? Yep. Smooth? Yep. Fast? Feature-packed? Reliable? Yep, yep, yep…… Bar none, I don’t think anybody from any camp can argue with Yamaha’s blend of the utmost levels of engineering, quality, refinement, reliability, technology and all-round performance that these sleds bring to the market.
If Yamaha simply wanted to beat everyone else out on price, they probably could. Yamaha Motor Corporation is so big (compared to the competitors), and sleds make up such a small part of their overall business that they could sell sleds at cost without seriously hurting their overall financial viability as a company. The point here is, the ‘little’ snowmobile group at Yamaha has it’s own goals, and profitability is the number one goal. Build a premium product for the right target that represents great value, and you will be able to charge a premium price for it. Unit volume is one thing, but profitability is where the fun begins!! The more profitable they are, the more they can innovate and develop and improve and push the limits of convention and design into the future. I believe that’s how Yamaha is thinking as we head into a new era in snowmobiles. Creep up the number of units sold while mainting these profits, and that's an obvious recipe for success.
Does this mean all Yamaha riders should want BMW's? Nope. It's all about what's important to you and your needs. People buy Kia’s for their own reasons, and other people buy Aston Martin’s for their reasons. I don't drive any of the cars I’ve mentioned (but man would I love a new Kia
), nor do I ride a new Yamaha sled either. I'm true blue through and through, but I simply can't justify the cost of any new high-end sled at this point in my life, no matter who manufactures it. With that said, the things that Yamaha brings to the table are important to me for my reasons, and if I had the coin, I’d already have a shiny new deposit receipt to stare at for the next 10 months. I'm taking donations
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DoktorC
Member
Very well said!! I think that perfectly sums up both the Yami rider and Yamaha's direction with ALL of their products...Not built for everyone, but built perfectly for their target market...that being said who here has a stock sled lol? Who has a stock M3?
I've always found Yamaha products brought with them a little more "class" or stature...you paid more to get something that is put together correctly with better materials. This is why your Yamaha will always get you home whether it be a PWC, Sled or Outboard. I am also true blue..and I'm biased (freely admited) but Yamaha has earned my loyalty with great products...
I've always found Yamaha products brought with them a little more "class" or stature...you paid more to get something that is put together correctly with better materials. This is why your Yamaha will always get you home whether it be a PWC, Sled or Outboard. I am also true blue..and I'm biased (freely admited) but Yamaha has earned my loyalty with great products...
Yamaha Power to Satisfy
New member
WOW!! dstoehr and DoktorC..... I never knew that i rode with such intelectuals. All kidding aside. I am in full agreement with the majority on this site. Yes generally speaking we all like Yamaha (hence the name totally yamaha). There is a reason that we all have likes and dislikes about our toys (whether they are sleds, pwc's, 4 wheelers, bikes, cars, trucks etc). As was said sure some sleds are faster, some better in the big bumps, but what i think has been really "nailed" is that Yamaha generally is above average in all areas. Sure your sled might not be the fastest or the best ditch banger, but i can tell you from experience that every time i get off my sled at the end of the day... there has been a smile on my face from ear to ear. Truthfully speaking, my friends got me on a Yamaha, back in 93 (Exciter II). I was on cloud nine. Sure it wasn't the fastest sled around or the best ditch banger, but that being said, i always had that smile on my face at the end of the day.
Looking back at posts on various subjects, i can safely say that many hundreds of people were greatly anticipating the roll-out of the '06 sleds (highest online rate recently). It is pretty obvious that there were other people from the other camps looking to see what Yamaha had to offer. Now it might not be what they were looking for, but to most Yamaha faithful, it's a step in the right direction and exactly what we want. We like to see new technology and changes and in my opinion, Yamaha tends to perfect their technology before they show it to the customers. So we may not have a turbo sled this year but you can be certain that if and when it does come out, it will be as reliable as all their other vehicles. To me reliablilty is number one. So if i have to spend a few more bucks to not have to walk home after breaking down, well then sign me up.
What I'm saying is that we know what we like for whatever reason and we are willing to pay for Quality. The new sleds look great and have peaked our curiosity. Don't pay attention to other people if they don't like it. If you like it you ride it. I personally can't wait to see and try the new sleds.
Looking back at posts on various subjects, i can safely say that many hundreds of people were greatly anticipating the roll-out of the '06 sleds (highest online rate recently). It is pretty obvious that there were other people from the other camps looking to see what Yamaha had to offer. Now it might not be what they were looking for, but to most Yamaha faithful, it's a step in the right direction and exactly what we want. We like to see new technology and changes and in my opinion, Yamaha tends to perfect their technology before they show it to the customers. So we may not have a turbo sled this year but you can be certain that if and when it does come out, it will be as reliable as all their other vehicles. To me reliablilty is number one. So if i have to spend a few more bucks to not have to walk home after breaking down, well then sign me up.
What I'm saying is that we know what we like for whatever reason and we are willing to pay for Quality. The new sleds look great and have peaked our curiosity. Don't pay attention to other people if they don't like it. If you like it you ride it. I personally can't wait to see and try the new sleds.
03viperguy
Moderator
I am right there with you guys. actually have an outboard and my home stereo are yamaha. just like the extra attention to detail and the nice fit and finish. I love my viper because it does just what I want. never get across the lake the fastest, but I hit the lake very little. I am always on trail and they are about 99.9% groomed. for me this makes the viper a great sled. same with the new sleds, for what they are going for (read the above posts 
) they are right on target. dok C seems to be adding a lot of good posts I agree with 
nice job! and thanks to mr sled for letting everyone voice there opinion, and for keeping it moderated pretty well
my story and I am sticking with it
) they are right on target. dok C seems to be adding a lot of good posts I agree with nice job! and thanks to mr sled for letting everyone voice there opinion, and for keeping it moderated pretty well my story and I am sticking with it
never_last_always_first
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- Mar 19, 2005
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- 34
apex kicks butt
In reply to the rev 800 and f7 beating a apex across the lake the is no way. i have a sxr 700 and a rx1 and the rx1 has not gotten beat yet. I have raced a f7, a rev 800, the 1000 ski doo, the polaris fusion, edge 800 and have not gotten beat. the apex is quicker and is a little lighter and have seen it at show and I think it is going to beat them even more.
In reply to the rev 800 and f7 beating a apex across the lake the is no way. i have a sxr 700 and a rx1 and the rx1 has not gotten beat yet. I have raced a f7, a rev 800, the 1000 ski doo, the polaris fusion, edge 800 and have not gotten beat. the apex is quicker and is a little lighter and have seen it at show and I think it is going to beat them even more.
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fourndog
New member
I was just on Dootalk and there are a lot of Rev riders jumping ship to buy the apex. For you guys that are complaining about price look at SkiDoo 06 prices they are right there with Yamahas and in some cases more expensive. If you ask me there is more technology in the apex motor then anything out there right now. Just my 2cents.
never_last_always_first
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rx 1 all the way
never_last_always_first
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- Mar 19, 2005
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never_last_always_first said:
How could they even say that and who are the racin....one PC tp the next...LMAO
low slung
Active member
I only have one problem with the new yamahas, I can't afford one right now. That said: the Apex, Nytro, etc are serious in looks and features. But I think the appeal of a yamaha snowmobile is more than appearance or capabilities. There is a feeling when riding (hard to describe) that goes beyond banging through the moguls or blasting your opponents off the lake. I can do these things but I don't need too just to feel I have the better sled. Honda ATVs and even my Stihl chainsaws give me those same feelings of quiet mechanical confidence: I know its great; I don't have to prove it everytime.
The 06 yamis will bring alot of crossover riders to yamaha but those chasing "the next best thing" won't stay. Those who know (or those who will come to know) what I mean will stay.
Then again, maybe this is just the stuff you think about when you spend too much time refueling your sled indoors.
The 06 yamis will bring alot of crossover riders to yamaha but those chasing "the next best thing" won't stay. Those who know (or those who will come to know) what I mean will stay.
Then again, maybe this is just the stuff you think about when you spend too much time refueling your sled indoors.
I agree LowSlung....true blue Yamaha guys stay loyal thru the hard times 
I think anyone that is here respects the traits of Yamaha; Including the fit finish and reliability. The negative comments generally do not attack those particular traits, but the fact that some of the markets have been left all together.(ie: kids&Ditchbanger)
NY_SXR700
Member
blueje17, I think you shoudl try a second 05 RX. I did not ride my buddies but I ran next to it a few times and I can tell you it is a ROCKET it's all stock except for filters and clutching. That thing went head to head with a new Mach-Z/F7/F8 and beats them all. That 05' RX is wicked fast and at 50 mph pulls the skis 2' in the air and goes like hell. After talking to the guys that have driven the new 06' Apex sleds like 100 miles worth of riding, they can't speak enough about how sweet they are and how much stronger they are then the 05's. As for all this weight crap, you can ride a Venture just like a Bravo if you have the meat on your bones. I think the SRX is light and I am not a superman I just ride hard and do what it takes to stay in 1st place when I have too. I ride the SXR but rode the 98' SRX last weekend for 100 miles and had a smile on my face the entire day even in the 2 foot studder bumps on Tug Hill. Sure my back hurt for 2 days but at 38 I don't care I had FUN that SRX was a blast. I also rode a Cat 600 ZR EFI that day (cuz my SXR tossed a ring). The ZR was very light and I thought it was a toy. It sucked up the bumps and was a soft ride. In my opinion I will take the Corvette over the caddy all day long. The same day I also rode a 03 ported piped PAC F7 EFI and I gotta say the clutching was snappy but the sled was no fun to ride. It was tippy as hell and I could not stand all the body english I had to use to keep it on the x-trak at camp. I think I got more tired trying to keep the F7 on it's skis than muscling the SRX through the twisties on the way to Kesog. I have to say in our type of riding in NYS the proaction has been good the REV is OK in a straight line but over all the ProAction was best all around, IMO. I ordered a 2006 Apex-GT and I can't think for a min. that I made a wrong move. I also believe the sled will come out of the box with more than 150hp in it's shipping form (after break-in). Doug
low slung
Active member
Ditch banger is taken care of with the nytro. As for a broader model line, the more yamahas that are sold, the more money that will get plowed back into R&D. More than any other manufacturer, yamaha runs their sled op. as a stand alone business. Sharing bike hardware occurs simply to bring down cost; no money from the bike end is sent down the line to support sled R&D. At least thats the impression I get from more than one mag. interview with their head men.
Yamaha is positioning itself very smartly as a maker of premium sleds, a lexus of the snow, leaving others to battle for market share in less lucrative segments. Even I thought this strategy was mad when I first read about. Now?
I never had or wanted a sled with electric start until the warrior and now, I can't see going back to a pull cord, or an oil bottle, or an engine without torque. Now? Now I know that whoever does the product planning at yamaha is a hell of alot smarter than I am.
Yamaha is positioning itself very smartly as a maker of premium sleds, a lexus of the snow, leaving others to battle for market share in less lucrative segments. Even I thought this strategy was mad when I first read about. Now?
I never had or wanted a sled with electric start until the warrior and now, I can't see going back to a pull cord, or an oil bottle, or an engine without torque. Now? Now I know that whoever does the product planning at yamaha is a hell of alot smarter than I am.
exp.rider
New member
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- Mar 20, 2005
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- 4
sled weights
I have been rideing for over 30 years, currently own 05 vector (wifes sled), 04 polaris pro x 2, 03 rxl, 98 srx700, 92 v-max 4 750. My polaris is quite a bit lighter than the rest of my sleds, but I could follow that sled anywhere I want with my 92 v-max. If you can't handle a couple extra pounds maybee you should hit the gym every fall before winter. The ones who complain about the weight are the sissy boys who have never rode a yami.
p.s. I have not had a sled touch my rx1 on the lake, pipes, clutch work and I also geared it down. Once your in front it's hard for anyone to catch up...
I have been rideing for over 30 years, currently own 05 vector (wifes sled), 04 polaris pro x 2, 03 rxl, 98 srx700, 92 v-max 4 750. My polaris is quite a bit lighter than the rest of my sleds, but I could follow that sled anywhere I want with my 92 v-max. If you can't handle a couple extra pounds maybee you should hit the gym every fall before winter. The ones who complain about the weight are the sissy boys who have never rode a yami.
p.s. I have not had a sled touch my rx1 on the lake, pipes, clutch work and I also geared it down. Once your in front it's hard for anyone to catch up...
exp.rider
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- Mar 20, 2005
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snow check prices
Has anybody had the chance to get the snow check prices on the apex gt or the apex rtx?
Has anybody had the chance to get the snow check prices on the apex gt or the apex rtx?
runwatyabrung
New member
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- Dec 18, 2003
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bleueje17 said:
Hmm I think reading Wade's journal is kind of interesting. Considering he (for the short time he had it) put the nytro ahead of the Fircat and Rev's.. Hmm. Plus boy it would be something if Yammi thought ahead while designing the vector to become the nytro.. boy could a company actually make a chassis for multiple use?? Nah..... Just like Pol thinking ahead and putting out the 600 ho in the Fusion chassis... Nah, companies wouldn't do that..
Not a cut on you BJ, Just very interesting reviews so far from people that felt like most of us about Yammi's. Good quality and stuff but just lacking the performance...
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fourndog
New member
exp.rider said:
I just ordered my RTX yesterday the price was $9732 if I took the $800 in accessories or $400 off that with no accessories. That is setup and freight included plus I get a belt and cover.
Allvipedup
New member
That's a good deal. The cover and belt alone are worth 200.00-250.00. I'm so tempted to do the same, but I got hold out for a couple years and just hop up the Viper.
exp.rider
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- Mar 20, 2005
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Quote
Do you have the dealers name and number I would like to get a price on the GT before I call my dealer...thanks
fourndog said:I just ordered my RTX yesterday the price was $9732 if I took the $800 in accessories or $400 off that with no accessories. That is setup and freight included plus I get a belt and cover.
Do you have the dealers name and number I would like to get a price on the GT before I call my dealer...thanks