so you want to play with nitrous?????

nosboy

nosboy

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I see lately a LOT of posts and a LOT of people selling HI TECH garbage on the internet... Without going into BASHING any company or product, let me try and shed a little light on the subject....Nitrous, first of all, is NON FLAMMABLE!!!.. It VIGOROUSLY ACCELERATES combustion by carrying ( I forgot the exact number) OXYGEN molecules within nitrogen... Just as a snowmobile motor will "BURN DOWN" when ran TOO LEAN for a period of time,,,, NITROUS will do the SAME THING 100 times FASTER.... Therfore, the AIR/FUEL ratio MUST be consistent as possible... There are ways of increasing the FUEL pressure and the fuel amount to try and reack an optimum A/F ratio,,,but,,,, NITROUS is VERY MOODY!!! The pressure of nitrous from 70deg to 80 deg is 100 psi different!!!! if your nitrous lines get even 10 degrees hotter, you could be leaning out the sustem... This is a STEEL TUBE LAYING TOO CLOSE TO A WATER JACKET OR HOSE!!! Its as simple as that... There are ways to control the burn rate, there are ways to control the underhood temperatures, there are ways to control the bottle temp and also ways to control the fuel pressure, specific gravity ETC...ETC... My point being,,,, LEARN A LITTLE BIT about NITROUS BEFORE you shell out $500.00 for a "CHEAP" system...... THERE ARE NO SUCH SENTENCES THAT HAVE THE WORD CHEAP AND NITROUS IN THE SAME SENTENCE!!!!! I could go into the induction systems out there and the do's and dont's of nitrous (been there done that)..... BUT,,, do yourselves a favor and go to the library or get on the internet and read something about it... Once you understand the theory, you WILL HAVE A BLAST WITH NITROUS!!! Those who don't usually have a trip to the parts store in their future!!!!! Gary Oles nosboy
 
another major issue with nitrous that most people don't take into account is that it's not like a car where more RPM is more speed, a sled runs a continuosly variable transmission that is finely tuned to work with a certain amount of power, going and adding more ontop of that will often mean you overrev badly and lose most of it back to the ignition box or the porting or the pipe (sometimes they overrev so bad that they 4-stroke, not cool). basicly if you want to clutch your sled to run well off the juice, you lose most of the power you gain on it. if you clutch your sled to run ON the juice, first off, have fun with that, since you're trying to clutch with a 10 second testing window (yee haw) second, it's gonna act like a dog off the juice.

to me that's the most common misconception with nitrous on sleds, mountian applications can overrun alot of this by simply waiting until the motor starts to "bog" in the climb and lose rpm, at that point you add nitrous to get your rpm back and get you further up the climb.
 
GREAT POST JUNIOR!!! I had that very problem with my 99 SRX asphalt sled... Bought a 1500.00 HRP primary and spent a zillion dollars on different secondary ramps.... I finally sold it to a guy who knew about clutching!!!!! He got a full second off the et!!!!! KEEP UP THE GREAT POSTS!!! Gary Oles nosboyracing
 
I see the purge valves on sleds and I shake my head!!!!!!! Its a snowmobile,,,,,not a race car!!!!!! Race cars do that for a reason.... You doing it on your snowmobile just freezed the HEck out of the lines and dropped your pressure a hundred pounds!!!!!! GET MY POINT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Gary Oles nosboy
 
lol, thanks man, I appreciate it.

ya I agree with ya, it can be done and well, but it's not for the faint hearted or those that are new at this stuff. but you're gauranteed to break alot of bits along the way.
 
I'm familiar with N20 and that it is not flammable by iteself and when it heats up (ie injected into cylinder) it seperates and releases 2 Oxygen molecules to every nitrogen molecule. I also know that bottle pressure is influenced by temp, pressure effects the spray amount. So to me it would seem that you need a way to regulate the nitrous spray so its consistant every time, then add the correct amount of fuel to bring the A/F where you want it. The boss noss system does this, how do you propose its cheap garbage compared to a non-regulated Holley system that will spray different amounts of nitrous every time?

Junior - are you proposing that clutching a stock viper at 8400 rpm off the juice and then adding a 30hp shot allowing the over rev to 8900 rpms will cut so much timing that it will void the 30hp shot and a viper clutched at 8400 rpm off juice is a dog?

Just trying to learn here guys.
 
i don't know the perticulars about boss noss or any other system that regulates itself (ha-ha).. in order for a system to regulate itself, it would HAVE TO HAVE map sensors, egt OR O2 sensors. air flow sensors, barometric pressure AND ambient temperature sensors, SENSORS on ALL OF THE HOSES from the bottle BACK, AND a computer that would readjust 60 times a second!!! Plus pressure sensors in the lines AND adjustable fuel delivery system and programmable timing structures... so you see,,,,, In order for a FOOL proof system, it would probably cost you TEN GRAND, Someone with a HECK of a lot better education that MOST on this forum, and at the cost of about 100 pounds of computer gismos!!!!! Holley sells the book about nitrous systems... PLEASE READ and you will understand WHY I say what I say!!!!! Thank you Gary Oles nosboy
 
a Nitrous "shot" usually raises the rpm of an engine 400-500 rpm's IT MUST BE TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT that you need WAY HEAVIER flyweights to keep the motor from overrevving 9to say the least).. heavier flyweights on a STOCK sled will in effect slow it down...as far as a 30hp shot... i was thinking 30hp PER CYLINDER shot... Why would you only put 10hp per cyl????? seems kinda DUMB?????? (or is it just me???) YES, THE TIMING will HAVE TO BE retarded with a shot like that... AND the engine will run like CRAP with retarded timing and heavier fly weights... I AM GOING TO SAY THIS ONCE!!!! (and only once).... RACE CARS DO NOT DRIVE ON THE STREET AND STREET CARS DO NOT DRIVE AT THE DRAGSTRIP!!!!! i see DOZENS of NUMBSKULLS that think they have a race car at the dragstrip.. I've waited HOURS AND HOURS for the track people to clean up their messes.... think a 30hp nitrous shot is being like "KINDA PREGNANT"... Either you "step up with the BIG DOGS" or "STAY ON THE PORCH".... You can achieve 30hp by re clutching,pipes and reed cages..... it is a LOT CHEAPER than playing with something you aren't familiar with!!!! These "kits" on the market are for those who want to BRAGG that they got nitrous, but it really doesn't do what it was SUPPOSED to do.... THE NITROGEN is the big thing with NITROUS OXIDE... Everyone thinks its the oxygen.... the NITROGEN is the big thing in an internal combustion engine!!!! 100% oxygen and fuel wouldn't do ANYTHING!!!! The NITROGEN is what makes the EXPANSION!!!! Most people don't know that.... I don't have the time or energy to lecture a physics class today!!!!! spend a little time on the internet and look up nitromethane....see its properties and also look up methyl alcohol and see why little baby glow plug motors run at 30,000 rpm.... (and don't even get real hot)!!!!you'll understand about the nitrogen thing!!! Gary Oles nosboy
 
I'm not sure you know 100% of what your talking about reguarding nitrous on snowmobiles. A 30hp shot is equivalent of pipes on a viper, but when your not on the juice its 100% reliable and gets great milieage, when you want to play wth some 800-900's you got a little help. Saying that if your not going big don't go at all isn't the point. The boss noss system regulates bottle pressure to maintain a consistant shot, it has a seperate fuel system that offers some tunability, and once set will give a consistant shot every time, not for racing but for trail sleds that want a little more out of thier sleds without having to tune it everytime the temp changes.

I like old school to but technology does evolve and its worth looking at just like reading up properly on what your about to do to your sled. :)www.bossseats.com/bossnoss
 
A stock viper is to be lutched at 8500 rpm +or- 100 so clutching at 8400 off juice should still yield good results but on the juice revving to 8900 the cdi retards the timing past 8500 rpm while on N2O. Should be the best of both worlds.

Again I'm objectively learning.
 
sounds like you guys are argueing about who knows what about what. But I was told that nitrogen in a no2 system does not burn.
 
Huh, I know alot of guys who use both the Boss Noss and Boondockers 30hp systems and they absolutely love em'. On the gas day in and day out without a problem. They must all live in the real world, where are we and why is there so much b.s.. Last I knew 30 horsepower is a big gain on a trail sled. I guess all the magazine tests are wrong.

I agree with what you're saying if you're trying to get an extra 75 hp out of a trail sled with nitrous. Most of us are only looking for a modest gain, and have it reliably with boondockers and Boss Noss.
 
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i was wonderin that my self ejacamaro, but i was waiting to see if someone was gonna say it cuz maybe "yamaha's" are different.... i just don't get how a lot of people are usin them and not havin probs. i'm talkin just 20-30 shots here or there for myself, just if i'm a bit behind and need to catch up ya know, or a little bogged on a hill. i don't want a 15 gal tank and just lockin the button down. just a nice thing to have on hand tho!!! ;)!
 
kinger said:
A stock viper is to be lutched at 8500 rpm +or- 100 so clutching at 8400 off juice should still yield good results but on the juice revving to 8900 the cdi retards the timing past 8500 rpm while on N2O. Should be the best of both worlds.

Again I'm objectively learning.
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I would have thought you'd see alot more than a 500rpm gain from that much power, if someone wants to try it with a 30hp hit and verify I'd be appreciative tho

did some reading on the boss noss kit, I'd like to see a picture of this fuel delivery system they are talking about, anyone have one?
 
sxviper32 said:
i was wonderin that my self ejacamaro, but i was waiting to see if someone was gonna say it cuz maybe "yamaha's" are different.... i just don't get how a lot of people are usin them and not havin probs. i'm talkin just 20-30 shots here or there for myself, just if i'm a bit behind and need to catch up ya know, or a little bogged on a hill. i don't want a 15 gal tank and just lockin the button down. just a nice thing to have on hand tho!!! ;)!
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We have a guy in our club that runs boondockers on his xcsp 800 and goes through a bottle a day. He's just as happy as can be with it. Talk to NOSPRO, he's put nitrous on everything.
 
a consistent shot is JUST WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT!!!! Theres NO SUCH THING AS A CONSISTENT SHOT!!! There are just too many variables... if you do a shot every 30 seconds, the transfer lines get really cold..... the cold lines will drop the nitrous pressure at least 100 psi.. HOW CAN THAT BE CONSISTENT??????? STEEL BRAIDED LINES are absolutely THE WORST thing to use!!!!!!! PLEASE READ THE BOOK!!!!!! Gary Oles nosboy
 
as far as the nitrogen burning.... NO.... NITROGEN doesnt burn.. It creates the EXPANSION that pushes your piston down so forcefully..... 100% oxygen and fuel won't do a damn thing without the nitogen.... The nitrogen doesnt have to come in NOS... it could come in ambient air itself.... WHY DON'T YOU THINK THEY JUST DON'T RUN PURE OXYGEN BOTTLES????? Why does it have to be NOS???? I told you in a post before, I AM NOT GIVING PHYSiCS LESSONS on this forum... You have to find it out for yourself.... I suppose it ALL HAS TO DO WITH my last sentence about the race cars and street cars... THE puppies want to sit on the porch with the BIG DOGS all the time.. Trouble is,,,, there aint enough room on the porch for them all,,, Thats why the BIG DOGS get to sit on the porch and the little dogs stand around and watch!!!! If you're from Chicago, You probably know EXACTLY what I am talking about... if you don't understand,,,well,,,,,,WATCH THE BIG DOGS!!!!!!! You'll learn... Gary Oles nosboy
 
With a 60hp shot on his vector and it raises about 600 rpm's.The same thing on a rx1.0 hp shot on a rx1 is worh 1 second and 15 mph in a 1/4 mile without reclutching on a 4stroke.
 
SRX 780 no arguing just learning :)

nosboy - we are talking about a spray here and spray there only when you want a little juice, not a continous spray where the other variables you mentioned would come into play, just something to pull ahead on a lake run or open field burst. Big dogs little dogs?!? Lets keep it objective and tell us WHY a boss noss or boondockers kit wouldn't work on a yamaha not the physics of nitrous. Lots of people run them with good success. Thanks
 
kinger said:
SRX 780 no arguing just learning :)

nosboy - we are talking about a spray here and spray there only when you want a little juice, not a continous spray where the other variables you mentioned would come into play, just something to pull ahead on a lake run or open field burst. Big dogs little dogs?!? Lets keep it objective and tell us WHY a boss noss or boondockers kit wouldn't work on a yamaha not the physics of nitrous. Lots of people run them with good success. Thanks
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Amen to that.
 
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