ViperXC
New member
So why aren't all the 4-strokes fuel-injected? If the Venture is a 120hp fuelie then why not all of them? I was thinkn they would all be fuel-injected after this year.
horkn
New member
ViperXC said:
apparently the pimped out venture in the apex chassis has 5 more hp, yet they call it still a 120, but the 120 FI motor. If you look at the normal venture, it shows the motor as a 120FI, and 40mm carbs which obviously was a contradiction.
I figured they would EFI all the 120 class sleds as well. the phazers that cost quite a bit less are efi.
Groovetastic
New member
I believe all of that innovation is what causes the lack of quality control. If you're building a new sled every year do you also have the time and resources to fix the old ones?maxout01 said:
I wonder if those dealers realize yamaha gave up on selling huge volumes of sleds back in '02 when they dropped all the 500s from the lineup. It is surprising they still have that many leftovers though.
horkn
New member
there are a lot of errors on the 09 yami website
the rs venture says it has a 121" track near the top of the features page, and then later in the same page it says 144"
I made a screen shot of the "FI" moniker on the normal rs venture. as I figured after this is posted a link would not show the mess up, but be corrected.
Anyways the FI of the rs venture GT says 6hp more than the carbed venture, and better fuel economy to boot.
the rs venture says it has a 121" track near the top of the features page, and then later in the same page it says 144"
I made a screen shot of the "FI" moniker on the normal rs venture. as I figured after this is posted a link would not show the mess up, but be corrected.
Anyways the FI of the rs venture GT says 6hp more than the carbed venture, and better fuel economy to boot.
Well maybe if some of you 2 smoke guys would come on a ride I could show you how good these 4 strokes are.... always welcome to try any of the 4 that I own....along with my brothers.....
FX Nytro RTX
New Phazer.
Attak GT
will have a XTX and a New Venture GT or even the RS Venture....
FX Nytro RTX
New Phazer.
Attak GT
will have a XTX and a New Venture GT or even the RS Venture....
Groovetastic said:
My point though is that skidoo stuck to thier sleds for more then two years. They didnt change the rev right away. They didnt back out on people wants and needs. They didnt give up on 2 strokes because of emissions laws. They kept the same motor, same chassis for years and worked on them to try to improve them. Did they fail with some things.. YES.. But They are not turning thier backs they are trying to improve alot. The are constantly trying to make them better and not give up.. ie the new etec. But they also took a well developed product and work to make it better. They let the rev chassis stick and work out its flaws and then made it better. They didnt turn thier back on the 2stroke world they try to make them better. I think you are right in a point though. The skidoo motors were having so many problems because they were making them fit a new standard and the motors were not completely ready.. which caused lots of quality issues. BUT instead of giving up completely, they make it better and better moving towards giving people what they want and making it last and work for the standards set, and for the consumer. They are doing that again by introducing the new 1200cc four stroke. Starting a new standard for buyers and to compete, but at the same time keeping old motor design and also making them perform and last better then ever before. They might not be as reliable but that is because you cant make something work perfect over night, you have to work out the flaws constantly. They will get there. But they wont stop making things completely just because its easier, or more reliable. They keep working to make them better. Instead of offering a new chassis every two years, they stuck to one for a long time. Instead of ditching the motors and giving customers only one style choice, they changed the same motor to try to improve it. At the same time they offer what people want, and there will be a day when the motor sitting in the skidoo will be very reliable, and you will still have a choice as to whether that motor is two or four stroke. They loose out in some respect.. because it takes time to improve things and failure is always there. To me though good products come from what the customer's needs are, and how a company meets those needs and improves them to be good for the customer without giving up.
I think the relibilty of a yamaha shouldnt be only in a four stroke heavy sled. It should be in a 2 stroke.. or a four stroke. It should be in a light package or a heavy package. A sled is more then a motor, it is ride comfort and ease of use. Yamaha will get there with the new suspensions, but ride comfort and usability is more then the motor and skid in a sled. I see the push from skidoo to improve and still offer the needs and wants of customers, but yamaha seems to be sitting down thinking its better then others when they need to realize there is alot of customers that want thier product but arent suited with their needs.
ViperXC said:
Why bother... the 120 4stroke is so fuel efficient and snappy... it will just cost more to have on the machine...
MrSled said:
Guys you just got the offer of a lifetime here! Drivin Mr.Sleds aaaa sleds is kinda like driving the Presidents Limousine!!!
LOL
In all seriousness, on every one of the last 3 TY rides that I have attended we have had one of you die hard 2 stroke guys say their "next sled will be a 4 stroke Yamaha" after spending some time on one. As far as the lack of fuel inj on the Vector line? I asked that very question to Yamaha. Inj does not make any more power (just consistancy) and in trying to keep the midstream sled costs down they elected to leave well enough alone. My wifes Vector gets over 20mpg's with Carbs!!!!
Yamaha has a darn good product line right now and for 2009.
YamaChris
New member
I can see guys with a 4s nitpicking the lineup, but how can any of us with old 2s complain? They have plenty to choose from if I am in the market for a new one.
BTW how often has Yamaha ever responded to HP wars? Vmax-4? Srx was just fast, beating up on bigger cc and hp sleds.
BTW how often has Yamaha ever responded to HP wars? Vmax-4? Srx was just fast, beating up on bigger cc and hp sleds.
BlueIronRanger
New member
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2003
- Messages
- 315
The only thing stopping me from hopping on a 4 stroke is my personal accountant (A.K.A. WIFE!) I spent some of my time this winter switching between my well setup SX600R (runs even with stock sx700r's) and a Stock Phazer GT. From 0-60 that phazer had me beat every time, 60-80 I catch up and pass, 80+ I would walk away easy. From 0-70 the phazer is a blast ans will be my next sled. I'm Hoping they release an XTX version since I want the Utility of a 144" track for lugging around a portable fish house in the snow and the handling of a 121" sled. If not I need to decide on a Mountain and cut the track down to 1.25 and add wide front A-arms, or stretch a regluar one to 136-144 and have to buy a new track.
2001SRX=Fast
New member
Yea, once again disapointed.
bluemonster1
LIFE MEMBER ONLY ONCE!!!
Hey dude!!!!!
2001SRX=Fast....have you sold my sled yet...you know ..the one that was supposed to be mine.Do much riding this year or are you just working to much at CN.
2001SRX=Fast....have you sold my sled yet...you know ..the one that was supposed to be mine.Do much riding this year or are you just working to much at CN.
2001SRX=Fast
New member
Sled's are gone.. Just purchased a 2008 yami grizzly 700 SE pick it up monday
bluemonster1
LIFE MEMBER ONLY ONCE!!!
no more sleds,now you are going to play with the slow toys...lol
2001SRX=Fast
New member
Yup gonna give something else a try... We dont get the winters like we used to here.... This season is officaly over now and it was just too short i only made one trip this year to falcon lake and that was the 99% of my ridding time.
journeyman
Active member
You would think on paper the turbo woud be the sh&t, but the magz tested it on the lakes and was pulling 105-106mph. You would think they'd do better than that. Heck alot of stock Apex's have been done much better than that on GPS.justaviper said:The new cat turbo is on my mind after seeing the 09 Yammy's. Nothing to impressive there. They are very nice machines but i need more power.
journeyman
Active member
I still own my Viper only because of financial restraints. I ride in the UP every year and have had alot of experience with the new 4 stroke Yammies up there. The Apex and Nytro both will smoke my Viper and I have a VERY good running Viper too. I love the turn key start, the reliability of the new Yammies, not to mention the sweet sound and the great fuel mileage. I just wish I had as much spare cash laying around like I did before I had kids. The new Nytro RTX SE would be high on my list for a new sled....but I still love the APEX models too.S.X. said:I really cant believe some of what I am reading here, some of you guys are complaining about the lack of an 09 that meets your style? Exactly what will make you leave your 2 strokes?
I would like to invite any of you that live in Michigan or the surrounding areas to come up to Munising the last weekend of the month (snow permitting of course) and spend some decent time on my Attak or one of the many Apex's that should be there. Weather permitting we are getting a last minute TY ride going. I really think you may have a different outlook on the potential of the 150hp sleds if you spend some time on one, or even a well tuned Nytro, you may be amazed as to exactly what is present and available from Yamaha!
PS: let's not forget the 4 year warranty and a 5th for $100....none of them can match that.
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As much as I'd like to take the 4 stroke plunge, I'm in the same boat, with two kids and a mortgage, car paymnets etc.
I'm keeping my Viper S for now, and have just orderd an M-10, which should address my only complaint with the sled.
2datrl
I'm keeping my Viper S for now, and have just orderd an M-10, which should address my only complaint with the sled.
2datrl
Well to all you guys that said us 2strokers need to ride a four stroke.. I rode an 08 nytro this weekend for about 100 miles. I have to say the power is very smooth and unbelievable. The ride is also very smooth over bumps, moguls. Much improved from years past. Heres my problem with it though. I dont know if I rode it more if this would go away but.. I was VERY uncomfortable with the size and stability. Every turn through the trails actually scared me. It feels to wide in the front and too heavy and I felt like every time I wanted to through the sled around, it threw me around. I didnt feel in control which is what scared me. Now on the lake.. I smoked every MF out there.. BUT another sled we were trying out was the 09 revxp 800R.. Holy crap is that thing fast for a 2 stroke! The nitro got a run for it's money on the lake.. BUT easily wooped it in top end though! The nitro sounds like a jet flying down the lake wow it was awesome, the 800R sounds like a 454 with open headers cool too but not close to the nitro.. Both of these sleds impressed me. I rode the 800R through the trails too. It honestly was the most easy going fun ride I have ever had on sled. I noticed the yami was very close to that but I would have to get over the nervousness I got every time I went through the twisties. It might have been the weight that made me feel that way, but in time I think I would be happy with it. BTW these were both rentals me and some buddies took out yesterday. Both had about 500 miles on the odo when we started, about 800 when we stopped. The skidoo can woop the shit out of the nitro in the trails, the nitro can woop the shit out of the doo everywhere else, especailly quality.
Ski doo : Superb handling. Best sled ever made for handling. You dont even have to do anything to ride it. Sit and enjoy. Too bad doo cant get quality down. The sled impressed me. And I think yamaha has in alot of ways caught up to that but they need to refine it. Anyway my review!
I'm still not ready for the 4 stroke yet..
Yami: Awseome clean feeling power and refinement. Definitely beat in the trails by doo, but far exceeds it in power/quality. some more seat time I think would get me to enjoy the trails more on it.
Anyway my review!
I'm still not ready for the 4 stroke yet..
Ski doo : Superb handling. Best sled ever made for handling. You dont even have to do anything to ride it. Sit and enjoy. Too bad doo cant get quality down. The sled impressed me. And I think yamaha has in alot of ways caught up to that but they need to refine it. Anyway my review!
I'm still not ready for the 4 stroke yet..
Yami: Awseome clean feeling power and refinement. Definitely beat in the trails by doo, but far exceeds it in power/quality. some more seat time I think would get me to enjoy the trails more on it.
Anyway my review!
I'm still not ready for the 4 stroke yet..
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journeyman
Active member
maxout01 said:
Yes the 2008 Nytro had it's issues with handling. The 2009 does have some front end changes to help remedy those issues. Also most 2008 owners swapped out the stock skis in lue of something better. The skis on all the new Yammies have been a major gripe and for some reason Yamaha doesn't want to change them. Some think it's because of the situation Doo had a while back with the Pilots. (lawsuits) The Nytro beat the 800R on top? Wow, now I rode Pat's demo in Greenland, MI back in Feb. The holeshot was awesome and top end was respectable, but I didn't know it would out duel the 800R on top. I know the 800 Doo's if setup right are fast. The Apexes are still faster up top than the Nytro, but it takes a while to get by that wicked holeshot. For now the stock top end machine still looks like the Apex. The new turbo Cat's boost may be turned down a bit from the factory and I look for the tinkerers to get some good numbers from it next year. But for what it's worth ,the Apex is still an awesome machine for the trail cruisers and straighliners for not having a turbo or charger and being rated modestly at 150HP.