To answer Mr. Viper's question, and more.
mrviper700 said:
Hi Mikesr, so if gasoline is made up of a mix of chemicals,and the ethanol makes it burn cooler,what are they using to dilute the rest of the fuel??? because it (whatever combo the fuel is made from)evidently does burn hotter in the engine, maybe not from just the ethanol but what other chemicals is used to dilute the fuel, as the octane level is indeed lower,thus the ability to not burn is reduced and detonation arises. 2 stroke dont take to rattling the pistons well and for very long. The number of stock engine failures alone here on this site tells me the fuel is changing and the results are more heat-wrecked pistons. I also read that its formic acid from the ethanol thats causes the white/fuzz crud now found in the carbs on a usual basis. Please explain, I am always open to information. appreciate the reply.
OK, I will give you guys the crash course on gas. You might find it hard to believe, but it's true. Here is why I know it to be true. The company that I work for buys a lot of solvents, and alchohols. I have been traveling to chemical companies and oil refineries more than I cared to the last 20 years. Been to Shell, Exxon (before it was Exxon-Mobil), Dow, Union Carbide (before Dow bought them out). My job is to ask questions about the process, and in doing so I have been able to ask a lot of my own questions about gas.
Here is the part you will not believe. There is no formula for gas. I repeat, there is no formula for gas. When an oil refinery is making a certain grade of chemical, there are times when the process goes a little out of control and when that happens the control board operators divert the product stream to the biggest tank by far on the grounds. And that tank is called Mo-Gas (motor gas). Same thing happens when a process is started up after a maintenance shut-down or when a production unit is switching from one grade of solvent (for example benzene, isoprene, naptha) it takes time to get the solvent they are trying to extract from the mixture coming into the unit, within specification. And until that solvent is in specification, it is DIVERTED to the MO-GAS tank.
Now imagine dozens and dozens of units in a 2,000 acre oil refinery, all trying to make different things, and when they are not running within specification, they divert to stream coming out of the unit to either another unit, or to.....MO-GAS. If you don't believe it, think about this. Go to your local hardward store and buy a gallon of mineral spirits. Costs more than a gallon of gas, right? Yes it does. Which do you think the refinery would like to make more of, Mineral Spirits, or Gas? More money in Mineral Spirits, isn't there? But when the production unit is trying to run Mineral Spirits and goes out of whack, then they have to divert the stream coming out of the unit to something far less profitable...like Gas. Sometimes to another slop tank for things like charcoal lighter fluid. Depends on what unit is trying to make what and how far out of specification it is. A refinery is a really complex operation.
Now, here is this big mother of a tank (and there are more than one) called MO-GAS, and it is nearing the top. They stir it up. A technician goes out to the tank for a sample. They run the sample in a very small engine in what is called the KNOCK-ROOM, and they get a KNOCK RATING. The rating could be anywhere, it's all over the board depending on how much of what kind of waste all the little individual production units have dumped into it. They determine the knock rating, they know how many gallons are in the MO-GAS tank, they add whatever they need to to raise the octane rating (yeah, they might even use ethanol) to whatever they have for orders at the moment (87, 89, 93, whatever). They restir the tank, get another sample, run it on small engine in the KNOCK-ROOM, and if they need to, they can add more of whatever they have a surplus of at the moment, to derive the octane they need. They certify the tank at that octane rating, and pump it off into barges, or into pipelines for distribution all over the country.
All without a formula. Amazing. Yes, there are additive packages added to certain grades at certain refineries. I was told at several different companies by several different people that typically the premium grade has the additive package no matter what the brand, so once in a while it is a good idea to get a tank full of premium of your car.
I can't tell you if the formic acid from ethanol is causing crud on the carbs. There are so many different chemicals in a gallon of gas and the concentration and compositioin changes with every full tank of MO-GAS depending on what the refinery is running that day, that I don't think anyone could pinpoint. If this crude is present running pure ethanol, then it is pretty much a no-brainer I guess.
Couple other things to make mention of. There are small piston-engine aircraft that are set up to run on ethanol and they don't have any higher incidence of engine problems or failures than their counterparts running aviation fuel. The biggest problem they are concerned with is the difference in vapor pressure of the fuel at high altitude - could cause vapor lock, which makes for an exciting time when the fan out front stops on a hot day.
One final thing. Don't think that just because you buy gas from a station advertising a certain company's name, that this gas came from that refinery. Ain't necessarily true. Just park your car outside a distribution center where the tanker trucks go to fuel up for deliveries to your favorite gas station, and the sign out front might say BRAND X, but you will see all different BRANDS on the side of the tanker trucks coming in and out.
I will be without computer access until next week, and will check back in then.
on the right fuel!!