just for shit's and grins,,, go to amsoil's website and look at their MSDS Material safety data sheets for their octane booster and see what it is..
it's between 60 and 95% KEROSENE.. which is NOTHING MORE than REALLY WELL FILTERED DIESEL FUEL with the paraffins removed... but,, what do I KNOW ????nosboy said:
readily availableto me.. so this will work?
100 OZ XYLENE
25 OZ mineral spirits
3 OZ ATF
100 OZ XYLENE
25 OZ mineral spirits
3 OZ ATF
FJViper
New member
Hope you feel better soon Gary. Get some rest.
Yes,, it will work just FINE.. Did you look at amsoil's octane booster???? look at the percentages .. ADD THEM UP and they will add up to 100%.. if the cleaner is 1=5 percent and the lubricant is 2 to 3 percent,, that means that the MAIN ingredient is ???? about NINETY tWO percent KEROSENE ... Eight dollars a 16 ounce can for 92% kerosene??????? 16 ounces for EIGHT DOLLARS ???? SIXTY FOUR DOLLARS FOR A GALLON OF AMSOIL'S KEROSENE ( sorry,, octane booster plus a few ounces of synthetic lubricant ( hence the color) ))) OR you could go to holiday and get the SAME GALLON of KEROSENE for about FOUR DOLLARS AND TWENTY NINE CENTS..... add 3 ounces of atf and you're right there !!!tomseal6 said:
nwe're on our way home.. I can't pack anything so I'm steady pissing people off on the websites while she gets us ready for the drive... about 8 hours back to CHITOWN !!! THANKS FOR THE WELL WISHES !!!!FJViper said:
My point is that your mixture makes 1 gallon that is roughly 114 octane. That will not do a whole lot when mixing it with 10+ gallons of 93 octane.
jasburrito
New member
the mix
My dad was mixing the same stuff for his 68 vet with a high compression 383. Seemed to work like a charm. Note I did blow the motor going from 3rd to 4th on the eway. Rod knock. He was pissed. The high r's through the side pipes sounded great.
My dad was mixing the same stuff for his 68 vet with a high compression 383. Seemed to work like a charm. Note I did blow the motor going from 3rd to 4th on the eway. Rod knock. He was pissed. The high r's through the side pipes sounded great.
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The tolly is 114 octane.. the 25% kerosene is well over 130 octane...I'll have to spell it out for you if you insist.. but a 5% mixture will bring it well over 110.. 10% mixture will be 114 even if you use 87 octane...twyztid said:
They call it JET -A- .. it.s PURE KEROSENE.... at it purest point.. they strictly watch it's purity levels.... No paraffins and No sulfur.....
nosboy said:
Yeah, if you feel like it, please do. I just can't see how it is possible that 1 gallon of your mixture will increase the octane in a 12-gallon tank mixing it will 10-11 gallons of 87-93 octane.
taylzee
New member
I don't see the math either as far as actual increase in octane rating goes, but I'm not a petromechanical engineer. I am not disagreeing though...there maybe other forces at work within the cocktail.
The way I see this:
If you run straight gas in a diesel motor (high compression), you will detonate way to early and fry the pistons/crank bearings, etc...becuase of pre-ignition. If you run diesel in a gas motor it increases your resistance to detonation, which allows you to run higher compression...i.e. more power on the stroke (kaboom) to force the piston down without cooking it or rattling it becuase of pre-ignition. You need to create the optimal position of the piston in the stroke with the combustion in order to create maximum power without frying things. (Timing and other things come into account here). If you put straight diesel in a gas motor it basically fouls and you don't get any power out of the stroke because you didn't get that optimal heat/resistance to detonation/compression/piston placement in the stroke with a hot enough combustion.
The way I see this:
It's trying to equate cetane to octane rating. They are not the same.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the proposed cocktail here is simply raising the resistance to detonation to something similar to 114 with the mix of 1 to 11 gallons in a 12 gallon tank for a high compression motor.
If you are trying to get more out of a stock motor by way of increased octane rating...you are wasting your time. Motors are designed to run on a certain octane.
Running a motor on 93 when it's designed for 87 is a waste of money.
Just my $0.02
The way I see this:
If you run straight gas in a diesel motor (high compression), you will detonate way to early and fry the pistons/crank bearings, etc...becuase of pre-ignition. If you run diesel in a gas motor it increases your resistance to detonation, which allows you to run higher compression...i.e. more power on the stroke (kaboom) to force the piston down without cooking it or rattling it becuase of pre-ignition. You need to create the optimal position of the piston in the stroke with the combustion in order to create maximum power without frying things. (Timing and other things come into account here). If you put straight diesel in a gas motor it basically fouls and you don't get any power out of the stroke because you didn't get that optimal heat/resistance to detonation/compression/piston placement in the stroke with a hot enough combustion.
The way I see this:
It's trying to equate cetane to octane rating. They are not the same.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the proposed cocktail here is simply raising the resistance to detonation to something similar to 114 with the mix of 1 to 11 gallons in a 12 gallon tank for a high compression motor.
If you are trying to get more out of a stock motor by way of increased octane rating...you are wasting your time. Motors are designed to run on a certain octane.
Running a motor on 93 when it's designed for 87 is a waste of money.
Just my $0.02
EXACTLY !!!.. Raising the motor's ability to resist knocking.... You hit it on the head,,, A motor fuel can ONLY be raised " so high"... If you have a 87 octane fuel and you try to raise it,,lets say TWENTY POINTS,,, you'd have to have an additive that has a BASE octane rating of ,,lets say 130.... You can ONLY add TEN PERCENT until you start changing the specific gravity and flash point, Once you start chainging the structure of the fuel,, you NEED TO CHANGE the way the fuel is delivered ( pressures and volumes).. Thats when you start getting into fuel injection strategys and fuel pressure changes) OR REJETTING ALTOGETHER.... As far as the " base octane of this concoction,, well,, DEPENDING ON THE QUALITY ( or GRADE) of stuff you use,,,, will make ALL THE DIFFERENCE when trying to " bump up" the octane of a BASE FUEL... Jet-A- works better than Kerosene that you buy from HOME DEPOT.... "Tolly" works better than " Zolly"... Synthetic trans fluid lubricates better,, but,, depending on the type,,, conventional atf BURNS SLOWER..... So you see... you can ONLY ADD SO MUCH to where it won't help anymore.. You can burn STRAIGHT METHANOL in your sled... ( I don't think it will run too well in the wintertime) but. IT WILL RUN.. You could run STRAIGHT "tolly" also,, but NOT with the "stock fuel system you have on your sled currently... ( same goes for alcohol.. you need STEEL or aluminum lines).. ( preferably stainless lines).. so you see,,,, it depends on a LOT of things.. Look at my FIRST POST and go from there.. it is NOT a SCIENCE unless we start CRACKING the ingredients and seeing EXACTLY what their makeup is... MSDS get you in the GENERAL NEIGHBORHOOD,, but ,, CHEMICAL COMPANIES do NOT give away their secrets!!! ESPECIALLY EXXON MOBIL..... I've tried for YEARS to get into their additive package information ,, but,,, it's a TRADE SECRET.. There is a series of tests,, and I can't even SPELL the equipment,, but it's called GCMS ( gas chemography (someting or other, Mass spectrometry... ) they " burn" it and watch the pretty colors,,, I've heard of it being done,, but never saw it...taylzee said:
go on amsoil's website and look up their octane booster,,, look for the MSDS of their octane booster and also look up the percentages of KEROSENE by adding up all the ingredients to come up with 100%.. Kerosene is about 94% in AMSOILS CONCOCTION.... SEE THEIR CLAIMS AND DIRECTIONS AND RULES for adding THEIR PRODUCT and you will see JUST HOW FAR you can GO with KEROSENE.... Like I said,, Jet-A- is a better grade than Kerosene you but at Home Depot or in the ground at your local filling station.... So, if you got an AIRPORT and you know someone who will sell it to you.. Jet-A- is the way to go... !!!
They used to mix KEROSENE and gasoline and the called it JP-4 or JP-8.. but.. I'm SURE they don't make that stuff anymore...
A couple of bucks
VIP Member
Jet A1 is similar to JP-8 & Jet B is similar to JP-4.
I'm not "hip" to al the new blends on the market lately... I've been out of the "loop" for a while... like 30 years out of the loop !!!
Some stuff is like riding a bicycle,, some isn't !!
Some stuff is like riding a bicycle,, some isn't !!
Gary, I think that some of the people here have (shall we call it) the wrong perception of octane rating.... I think that they are thinking the mix would make the base fuel more volitile... Hence the reason why race gas or high octane gas burns cooler and will make less power in a non modified or low compression engine. If you change the jetting you could gain back some of the lost power due to the richer fuel mix(I think), but why waste your hard earned coin on fuel that isn't necessary...
I learned a little with this thread, thanks Nosboy!
Oh, I think the common perception is also playing a role here, that you can burn up a motor by using high octane fuel or race gas when really it'll only run like crap.
I learned a little with this thread, thanks Nosboy!
Oh, I think the common perception is also playing a role here, that you can burn up a motor by using high octane fuel or race gas when really it'll only run like crap.
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Yes indeed.. It WILL make the fuel LESS VOLITILE...or LESS DANGEROUS to your motor... I've always had a hard time putting the right words into play for everyone to understand.. it's not you add two ounces and you get this,, but rather more of a science as, you add two ounces and you SHOULD BE ABLE TO ACHIEVE THIS.!!!Sxr700Bandit said:
Fingers typing and btain not engaged???nosboy said:
Also what you are trying to say may not be easily comprehended. I'll have to admit, I had to put some thought into what you are/were trying to say... Plus you started the thread and at first it was a little vague and needed some clarification but you were out for surgery. Then you came back after and were trying to explain without having a clear head. Don't beat yourself up too bad... Plus I think you shed some light on the subject and "schooled" us some.
I gave some thought to a statement that you made awhile back about many items being propellants, and lots of people don't see those items in those manners because we have been trained otherwise.
Here's a thought, I wonder how many people use WD-40 as starter for 2 strokes???